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Rackspace passwords are visible to customer service

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Re: Rackspace passwords are visible to customer service

#22
Ironically, I was just now on the phone on-hold with Rackspace waiting to activate my account, when I tabbed over to HN to see this post at the #1 spot. I tipped off the customer rep that they might want to come on over to HN and reply. Looking forward to seeing how they officially respond...

Re: Rackspace passwords are visible to customer service

#23

I asked a Rackspace rep about this. Here is the real deal: - passwords are NOT stored in cleartext - however, passwords are visible to customer service via a "secure, non-public tool" - the reason for this is because "people generally prefer to give out a password to authenticate themselves [over the phone] than portions of the billing information" - so if a user account database is stolen somehow, the malicious thie…

"- however, passwords are visible to customer service via a "secure, non-public tool""

"- so if a user account database is stolen somehow, the malicious thief would not have access to convenient info like email/username/cleartext password."

What if the secure, non-public tool is also stolen?

Re: Rackspace passwords are visible to customer service

#24

I asked a Rackspace rep about this. Here is the real deal: - passwords are NOT stored in cleartext - however, passwords are visible to customer service via a "secure, non-public tool" - the reason for this is because "people generally prefer to give out a password to authenticate themselves [over the phone] than portions of the billing information" - so if a user account database is stolen somehow, the malicious thie…

"- however, passwords are visible to customer service via a "secure, non-public tool"" "- so if a user account database is stolen somehow, the malicious thief would not have access to convenient info like email/username/cleartext password." What if the secure, non-public tool is also stolen?

The tool is probably for decrypting the passwords. The Passwords are probably hashed for verification to their website, etc, and then encrypted to a key which is encrypted to each tech's password as they hire new techs.

I'm sorry, I should say, this is how I imagine a good way to do it would be, not that it's how they do it.

This way though everything could be stolen and it wouldn't give up clear text passwords.

Re: Rackspace passwords are visible to customer service

#25

I asked a Rackspace rep about this. Here is the real deal: - passwords are NOT stored in cleartext - however, passwords are visible to customer service via a "secure, non-public tool" - the reason for this is because "people generally prefer to give out a password to authenticate themselves [over the phone] than portions of the billing information" - so if a user account database is stolen somehow, the malicious thie…

If they really don't want to verify hashes, is it really that hard to do a secure, partial information authentication system? - set a separate password for over-the-phone stuff - N specified letters from the password are requested by the customer service (3 - customer service puts them into the system and gets a yes/no response I don't reveal the root password to the person, they get good enough proof that I know the…

> set a separate password for over-the-phone stuff

Sorry, but I think this is the phone equivalent of insisting that you set a password using uppercase, lowercase, digits, symbols, at least 20 characters long and changing every 3 days. People are just going to start using obvious things or writing them down.

True story: A few months ago, I took out a new credit card. During the application process, including activating phone and Internet access, I was asked for something like sixteen different pieces of personal/security information. The first time I wanted to call them a few days later to check something was now ready, I was asked for my "pass code". I had no idea which of those pieces of information that was, so Call Centre Guy says not to worry, he can verify me via other details. He runs through a series of questions, at least one of which makes no sense in the circumstances (in fact, that was the reason I was calling). At the end, he says he's sorry but I've failed security and he has to hang up now. All he can say is that I haven't provided the required answer to all of the questions. I tried to go on-line, and was asked to enter some memorable information. Apparently, I gave them three different things during sign-up and any one of them would do. No doubt I chose someone's birthday, etc., but of course I had no idea who and there was no kind of prompt. So I couldn't get in over the Internet either. Finally, I gave up and went back into the branch, where the staff had been helpful and efficient while I was setting things up to start with. They called through to a special number... which transferred to the same call centre and resulted in the same series of security questions, even though I was sitting in a secure area of one of their branches, with an employee who had already authenticated themselves, and who had seen my passport and driving licence two minutes earlier (which means they had access to two photos, two signatures, and my current address as a minimum). I gave exactly the same answers I had given to the previous guy, explained in exactly the same way why one question didn't make sense, and was told that was fine and how could he help?

When I call my other credit card company, they ask for my six-digit DoB and typically my current credit limit to verify before doing anything significant.

My business account needs a single password for everything, and for extra security provides a device where you push a button to generate a six-digit code that changes every few seconds.

Two of these have the right approach. The one that uses separate security information for everything and all kinds of different types of validation is not one of them.

Re: Rackspace passwords are visible to customer service

#26
post #4

Does the author of this article not know about 2-way encryption? It can be used to store encrypted passwords in a database and the original value can be retrieved.

While the idea that Rackspace, a hardware and VM hosting provider, is really jeopardizing customers with passwords is pretty silly, it's still mostly a myth that you can use "2-way encryption" to securely store passwords in a database.

Anything the good guys can do to decrypt a password, assume the bad guys can too.

Re: Rackspace passwords are visible to customer service

#28
My favorite cheap PHP host is Bluehost. I like everything about them except that they ask for passwords over the phone, and mention that every time I talk to them. Not only is a secure password a pain to say over the phone ("amersand backslash carrot capital-H comma...") but I don't like the idea of a disgruntled employee trying out the same password on my email accounts, even if I don't use the same password.

Re: Rackspace passwords are visible to customer service

#29
First off, Rackspace's cloud services has totally different CS staff than their managed hosting services. I'm a managed customer and this has never happened. In fact, I had to deal with their cloud CS people regarding a DNS issue and got the run around.

Anyway, the managed folks ask for your portal password and a challenge question (high school mascot). In the 4 years I've used them, they have never asked for a root password to one of my boxes.

And, BTW, Softlayer does ask for your machine's root password in their support ticket form.

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