Why Garbagemen Should Earn More Than Bankers • Hacker News Board

Re: Why Garbagemen Should Earn More Than Bankers

#21

Post by monk_e_boy » Wed, Apr 27, 2016, 9:05 AM UTC

askyourmother wrote: post #17

One of the most important jobs in a hospital, is the cleaner. To help prevent the spread of infections like MRSI, to help keep outbreaks of vomiting virus under control, and help reduce the number of admitted and post procedure patients dying as a direct result of infection acquired in the hospital itself. And yet, they are treated as the lowest employees there, well, most are not even employees, outsourced three or…

> Society has some warped views sometimes.

At the moment, stopping to help a homeless person isn't worth anything. We should live in a society where helping someone in need makes you a millionaire. Where people are out hunting down the homeless, fighting to help them.

A society where helping a kid to become happy makes you rich. Making a classroom of kids happy and teach them something at the same time earns you tens of millions a year.

Re: Why Garbagemen Should Earn More Than Bankers

#22

Post by askyourmother » Wed, Apr 27, 2016, 9:08 AM UTC

monk_e_boy wrote: post #20

askyourmother wrote: post #17

One of the most important jobs in a hospital, is the cleaner. To help prevent the spread of infections like MRSI, to help keep outbreaks of vomiting virus under control, and help reduce the number of admitted and post procedure patients dying as a direct result of infection acquired in the hospital itself. And yet, they are treated as the lowest employees there, well, most are not even employees, outsourced three or…

Doctors are also important. And nurses. And the admin team. And the cleaners....

I didn't say they weren't important. But, what a waste, when the doctor saves the life via an operation, the nurse administers care, and the patient dies from an infection acquired due to a dirty ward, when it could be so easily avoided, by respecting the important role of the cleaner, starting with actually making them employees, paying them well, proper training, materials and care, and finally, giving them respect, so they feel proud, as they save the life just as much as the doctor or the nurse.

Re: Why Garbagemen Should Earn More Than Bankers

#23

Post by maehwasu » Wed, Apr 27, 2016, 9:20 AM UTC

The writer thinks of money as something people give to you, and so he's never going to make much of it.

He's totally right that no one would mourn a strike of lobbyists or high-frequency traders. But those guys aren't waiting to be handed money--they're actively finding ways to get it, for better or worse.

Re: Why Garbagemen Should Earn More Than Bankers

#24

Post by hvm » Wed, Apr 27, 2016, 9:26 AM UTC

maehwasu wrote: post #23

The writer thinks of money as something people give to you, and so he's never going to make much of it. He's totally right that no one would mourn a strike of lobbyists or high-frequency traders. But those guys aren't waiting to be handed money--they're actively finding ways to get it, for better or worse.

Exactly the problem the author is writing about: because of the way the system works - people are striving to make money, not value.

Re: Why Garbagemen Should Earn More Than Bankers

#25

Post by Tomte » Wed, Apr 27, 2016, 9:34 AM UTC

askyourmother wrote: post #22

monk_e_boy wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doctors are also important. And nurses. And the admin team. And the cleaners....

I didn't say they weren't important. But, what a waste, when the doctor saves the life via an operation, the nurse administers care, and the patient dies from an infection acquired due to a dirty ward, when it could be so easily avoided, by respecting the important role of the cleaner, starting with actually making them employees, paying them well, proper training, materials and care, and finally, giving them respect…

What a waste, when a patient dies in a shining, clean ward because no doctor was there. ;-)

But I agree, cleaners should be more respected.

Re: Why Garbagemen Should Earn More Than Bankers

#26

Post by yuzi » Wed, Apr 27, 2016, 9:35 AM UTC

armenarmen wrote: post #4

> Nearly a century ago, economist John Maynard Keynes famously predicted that we would work fifteen-hour weeks by the year 2030 In 1930, when Keynes predicted the 15 hour work week, the average American earned $1,368/year which is roughly $19,500/year in todays dollars. 19500/52 = $375/week. In 1930, in manufacturing, the average person worked 50.6 hours per week. ( https://eh.net/encyclopedia/hours-of-work-in-u-s-hi…

In 1930 my grandfather bought his house for $20K. So one years salary. But in 1930 people spent 80 percent of their monthly income on food. So house costs have gone up dramatically and food costs have gone down dramatically (as a proportion of income).

So even if consumption were to have remained the same, the costs of things would still adjust forcing people to work closer to 40+ hours a week.

Re: Why Garbagemen Should Earn More Than Bankers

#27

Post by joelrunyon » Wed, Apr 27, 2016, 9:52 AM UTC

askyourmother wrote: post #22

monk_e_boy wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doctors are also important. And nurses. And the admin team. And the cleaners....

I didn't say they weren't important. But, what a waste, when the doctor saves the life via an operation, the nurse administers care, and the patient dies from an infection acquired due to a dirty ward, when it could be so easily avoided, by respecting the important role of the cleaner, starting with actually making them employees, paying them well, proper training, materials and care, and finally, giving them respect…

Not saying that isn't important, but at some point, the cleaning only takes a certain level of skill.

Having a trashy ward - is much more likely a failure of the management / admin team in training & superversion than it is on the cleaner specifically.

Not saying you should treat cleaners poorly, but it does explain the wage level.

Re: Why Garbagemen Should Earn More Than Bankers

#28

Post by joelrunyon » Wed, Apr 27, 2016, 9:53 AM UTC

maruhan2 wrote: post #8

I wish there was a way to get rid of these bullshit jobs. Also, I wish there was a way to make entertainment business such as singing, acting, and sports much much less profitable.

Why do you care if it's profitable or not? People enjoy it. Why not let them spend their money on what they enjoy?

Re: Why Garbagemen Should Earn More Than Bankers

#29

Post by gvurrdon » Wed, Apr 27, 2016, 10:01 AM UTC

askyourmother wrote: post #17

One of the most important jobs in a hospital, is the cleaner. To help prevent the spread of infections like MRSI, to help keep outbreaks of vomiting virus under control, and help reduce the number of admitted and post procedure patients dying as a direct result of infection acquired in the hospital itself. And yet, they are treated as the lowest employees there, well, most are not even employees, outsourced three or…

I suspect that the reason they are so low paid is because it is a job that can be done with the minimum of training, and so it is easy to find replacements.

Re: Why Garbagemen Should Earn More Than Bankers

#30

Post by golemotron » Wed, Apr 27, 2016, 10:03 AM UTC

The thing about markets is that they cut through all of the fuzzy thinking about what jobs "should" pay more than others, and tell us what we actually pay - what we collectively find valuable.

That reality escapes most people.