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The Silicon Valley of Transylvania

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Re: The Silicon Valley of Transylvania

#21
post #11

This is a nice summary of what's going on - to get to the gist of it, Romania has great technical talent, coming out of decent technical schools. What severely lacks in Romania, in my view: a). the business environment; the internal demand isn't enough to support starting and growing business on the local market; building products for external markets from get-go is difficult. This leads to: b). the business talent;…

Very good points! c) goes hand in hand with two other things: many managers are former programmers with little or no appreciation for good product and good UX. And second, romanian designers are still pretty much artists, drawing candy stuff. I know some very good designers with good UX skills, but they are a minority.

Only where you have good managers, good devs, and good designers thinking solely about the people using the product, you'll have a community that gives birth to real software professionals. We're still in the age of Angular v React, Dawn of Outsourcing.

Re: The Silicon Valley of Transylvania

#23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in Romania. For potential readers: this comment's content is a gross overstatement and does not reflect reality. For example, over 50% of the population lives in an urban environment (see the CIA Romania Factbook which is very up to date). Even so, it would be wrong to assume that just because some of the country's citizens live in the countryside, they 'get around by cart and donkey'. Also, for the sake of ac…

To be fair, I was last there six years ago, spent most of my time travelling through the the countryside, a few weeks in Cluj, visited friends in Sibiu, and got robbed when I went through Bucharest on my way to Moldova. So yes, my view is far less accurate than yours, as it's from about six weeks six years ago - but the only place I saw comparable levels of overt corruption was Kyrgyzstan, and I've visited most of th…

Can you give some examples of corruption that actually hindered you? I consider corruption to be a minor-to-non-existent problem for areas like IT/tech here.

The main problem to me is the lack of entrepreneurship and the fact that there are lots of "stealth-startups" in Romania that will probably not even be incorporated in Romania ever, so they'll never show up on the radar as "Romanian startups", they will simply "pack up the whole team and move" abroad after the first big foreign investor spots them and invests/acquires with a "relocation requirement".

There are also entrepreneurs that run their companies disguised as outsourcing-shops while the real startup is actually the outsourcing-shop's client registered somewhere like USA-Delaware/Hongkong/whatever because it leads to better perspective from the customers. Of course, this is also a short term arrangement before the team of the company is swallowed by a bigger fish.

There is a lot going on, but int this part of the world very few of what's happening actually shows up on the radar as what it is.

Also... coming back to corruption, imho the greatest problem is lack of entrepreneurial spirit because the society and education actively discourages smart people from becoming entrepreneurs... so they end up engineers, doctors etc. ...or emigrate. Corruption really makes little difference because real innovation doesn't happen while working on projects for the state anyway. I think that a certain level of corruption can even help economic growth if used selectively - ie a bribe that sabotages a bigger international corporation from getting a contract for a state-financed development project in favor of a local startup (where, for example, one of the investors happens to be a local senator or whatever... probably not the best example but to get the point across) can actually result in more money funneling back into the local economy and fueling its growth... Everything can be a double edged sword in the bigger economic game.

The American obsession with corruption in other countries is imho more out of fear of being out-maneuvered by foreign local businessmen in the international economic game when it comes to uderhanded tactics :) (see http://www.amazon.com/Confessions-Economic-Hit-John-Perkins/... for context)

Re: The Silicon Valley of Transylvania

#25
Like other eastern european countries, Romanians suffer greatly with poor branding and "western-centrism".

While in Germany, I watched clear demonstrations of discrimination towards Romanians in a tech startup. They really had to prove themselves. Although extremelly talented, "jokes" would always fly around the "gypsy stereotype".

That being said, as a startup founder, I'd assume it'd be much harder to raise money from an UK VC firm.

Re: The Silicon Valley of Transylvania

#26

This is so bubble-written it's not funny. Romania is a country where a large chunk of the populace get around by cart and donkey, where post-communist corruption is rife, where decades on they still can't decide what to do with the half built palace that occupies half of Bucharest, where gangsters run most of the hospitality industry and god knows what else. It's a chicken and egg problem, of course, as enterprise wi…

I live in Romania. For potential readers: this comment's content is a gross overstatement and does not reflect reality. For example, over 50% of the population lives in an urban environment (see the CIA Romania Factbook which is very up to date). Even so, it would be wrong to assume that just because some of the country's citizens live in the countryside, they 'get around by cart and donkey'. Also, for the sake of ac…

[deleted]

Re: The Silicon Valley of Transylvania

#27
I worked +10 years in Redmond, WA as a microsoftie and came back to Romania in 2012. Since March 2016 I quit Microsoft and focused 100% on my startup, DBHistory.com. I now rent space and work at a local tech incubator www.techhub.com. I wanted to start with this to to put my opinion in perspective. While the article is bubble-gum and is clear PR, the point it makes is a valid one. Compared even to US, today Romania has a very active entrepreneurship mindset. Small businesses are created all the time, some thrive, some go under. Despite the locals skepticism, I see the economy here as effervescent, with a growth rate still north of 3% (for Europe, this is not bad). The overwhelming majority of this entrepreneurship is not in IT.

But this article is specific to IT, and I do not see the Romanian IT anywhere near its potential. This is because the local IT is almost entirely focused on outsourcing, not on original development. Big companies have significant presence here (Electronic Arts, Adobe, Intel, Microsoft each have ~200,300 dev offices here, although not everything is core R&D ). Original Romania IT has a very strong presence in anti-virus (for some reason it seems a lot of local IT youth are experts on exploits...). Many young IT Romanians choose to go abroad (in Microsoft Romanians are the 4th largest foreign community, after Indians/Chinese/Russians).

Since I've returned I've been approached several times by US/Western Europe based entrepreneurs who desired to move development to Romania and open office here, solely for cost reasons. Purely for outsourcing, this is my 2c:

- Romania has significant talent pool

- EU membership (with all tax/export/legislation alignment that entails)

- Good spoken English is pretty much universal, German/French are common

- Political stability (governing parties rotated power several times in past 20 years, peacefully)

- Cost is higher than one would expect. Bucharest/Cluj/Timisoara all have high cost (office) and salaries are higher than some neighbors. If the outsourcing decision is purely cost driven then Ukraine has a better deal for you, with a similar talent pool.

But I would like to see a lot more IT original development coming out from Romania. The article gives some examples, like LiveRail, but overall I see a lot more outsourcing done here than original development. I'm glad projects like cloudhero.io originate here.

Re: The Silicon Valley of Transylvania

#28

This is so bubble-written it's not funny. Romania is a country where a large chunk of the populace get around by cart and donkey, where post-communist corruption is rife, where decades on they still can't decide what to do with the half built palace that occupies half of Bucharest, where gangsters run most of the hospitality industry and god knows what else. It's a chicken and egg problem, of course, as enterprise wi…

[deleted]

Re: The Silicon Valley of Transylvania

#29
"the local higher education system is plagued by corruption" "Education is underfunded and affected by a profound brain drain." (notalaser)

This is so true, sadly! I can imagine the reason Tech Crunch is trying to light the stage in rose colors but it's good to keep your expectations realistic. Don't get me wrong, the Romanian higher education was very self-exigent and managed to spit out high quality specialists for quite a while even after the fall of the Iron Curtain. The good teachers however, were being hunted like crazy. Only in those several years of my Computer Engineering study I've had to witness the departure of half of the professor assistants that were teaching me at one point or another. The good half. On graduation only a small minority of my fellow student colleagues enjoyed meaningful support from their mentors. For most of us the mentorship was only a protocolar procedure, and the quality of our licence projects were being dictated only by our auto-didactic abilities - very far from what I heard University to be once upon a time!

Re: The Silicon Valley of Transylvania

#30
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, I was last there six years ago, spent most of my time travelling through the the countryside, a few weeks in Cluj, visited friends in Sibiu, and got robbed when I went through Bucharest on my way to Moldova. So yes, my view is far less accurate than yours, as it's from about six weeks six years ago - but the only place I saw comparable levels of overt corruption was Kyrgyzstan, and I've visited most of th…

I'm sorry for your personal experience, but you should be able to realize that traumatic personal experiences can cloud your opinion about a very complex topic such as a whole country. I visited the US and I wasn't really impressed, for example. But I wouldn't judge the US based on just what I saw in a couple of weeks, considering what I've read and seen about it. Oh, and regarding corruption: https://en.m.wikipedia.…

You visited the US and "weren't impressed"? Where did you visit exactlY? Its a very large country with over 200 milion people. What weren't you impressed with? What was lacking? Also where are you from thats more impressive?
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