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Bill Gates Says Apple Should Unlock the iPhone

techcrunch.com

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Re: Bill Gates Says Apple Should Unlock the iPhone

#21

Post by SeanDav »

tallanvor wrote: post #13
citizensixteen wrote: post #2

I do not understand why Bill Gates would take a contrary position to Silicon Valley / tech community on this issue. Any insight into why he is taking this stance? What I have found even more confusing is why the FBI hasn't asked the NSA for help. The NSA's thousands of skilled hackers simply can't break into an old iPhone?

Because people are allowed to have their own opinion? I don't agree with him, but I certainly don't base my opinion on this matter on the general sentiments in Silicon Valley. Regardless of the outcome of this case, the best thing that Apple, Google, and everyone else can do is to make sure that it's impossible for them to comply with future versions of the OS.

Bill Gates is well aware that people will take this, not as his personal opinion, but as the opinion of Microsoft. He could have made it it clear that this was his personal opinion and not related to the Microsoft position, but he did not.

Re: Bill Gates Says Apple Should Unlock the iPhone

#24

Post by saiya-jin »

dingo_bat wrote: post #12

Can anybody explain why unlocking just this specific phone is bad? Can't we decide on a case-by-case basis? It's not like Apple is being asked to backdoor all Iphones so FBI can read everyone's data. Just this specific one ordered by court. What am I missing?

my understanding - there is currently no software package created to allow this (ie modified kernel or whatever is necessary). government doesn't have resources/knowledge to do it on its own, otherwise they would already have it.

once this is created, apple would pressed HARD by all authorities to re-use it for all iphones captured. these days we know damn too well that people in CIA, aNSA etc don't hold any reasonable moral values when it comes to privacy of about anybody on this planet.

plus it could be taken from this specific phone and very probably copied anywhere, without any apple approval or court order.

if government was playing mr nice guy till now, there would be at least some hope and faith. currently, there is simply none.

Re: Bill Gates Says Apple Should Unlock the iPhone

#25

Post by saurik »

zer01 wrote: post #7

>"It is no different than [the question of] should anybody ever have been able to tell the phone company to get information, should anybody be able to get at bank records,” he said. “Let’s say the bank had tied a ribbon round the disk drive and said ‘don’t make me cut this ribbon because you’ll make me cut it many times’." Seriously? It's absolutely different (not to mention his ribbon analogy makes no sense at all).…

The reality is that Apple already has unfettered access to this device: they left themselves a backdoor to which only they have the key, in the form of a "secure" update mechanism that is so "secure" that even the user can't control it, only Apple can. To me the actual question here is whether the FBI should be allowed to ask and then force Apple to use the backdoor Apple built into their product; Apple painting this as if they are being asked to build a backdoor instead of use an existing one is them being nothing more than dishonest in an attempt to twist the story and shift the blame. So yes: I think it is fair to describe the security of this device, from the perspective of Apple, as nothing more than a ribbon, as Apple already has "unfettered access to [your] data". Apple trusts users so little that they don't give users control of the hardware they own... this is frankly a good lesson on them that this is responsibility they should never have hoarded. "Here's hoping that the iPhone 7 no longer has a backdoor that is controlled by Apple."

Re: Bill Gates Says Apple Should Unlock the iPhone

#26

Post by revanx_ »

madaxe_again wrote: post #4
citizensixteen wrote: post #2

I do not understand why Bill Gates would take a contrary position to Silicon Valley / tech community on this issue. Any insight into why he is taking this stance? What I have found even more confusing is why the FBI hasn't asked the NSA for help. The NSA's thousands of skilled hackers simply can't break into an old iPhone?

Because the US government is Microsoft's biggest customer by a country mile. Hand that feeds you and all that. The FBI already have the info they need, don't need nsa's help, this is purely about setting a precedent.

Exactly, especially now that the D.O.D. is rushing to upgrade every device to windows 10, what a joke ;d

Re: Bill Gates Says Apple Should Unlock the iPhone

#27

Post by simonh »

citizensixteen wrote: post #2

I do not understand why Bill Gates would take a contrary position to Silicon Valley / tech community on this issue. Any insight into why he is taking this stance? What I have found even more confusing is why the FBI hasn't asked the NSA for help. The NSA's thousands of skilled hackers simply can't break into an old iPhone?

Even the NSA don't have a magic wand for braking cryptographic security. Designing well engineered, secure cryptographic systems that are not hackable is a thing people can do and it appears Apple have done it.

Most of the NSA hacking has nothing to do with cracking cryptographic keys anyway, it's exploiting weaknesses in systems so you don't even need the keys at all. In this case, it appears they would need the keys.

Re: Bill Gates Says Apple Should Unlock the iPhone

#28

Post by pfg »

dingo_bat wrote: post #12

Can anybody explain why unlocking just this specific phone is bad? Can't we decide on a case-by-case basis? It's not like Apple is being asked to backdoor all Iphones so FBI can read everyone's data. Just this specific one ordered by court. What am I missing?

First of all, it sets a precedent that companies can be forced to create software that willfully compromises their security mechanisms. This is very much different from your typical data dump ordered by a judge. It's quite likely that the FBI and other law enforcement agencies would use such a precedent in many future cases.

Second, it's unclear how easy it would be to create firmware that only works on a specific device. What if there's a bug, or what if someone finds a way to spoof the device ID that would probably be checked? It could very well end up being a backdoor for all iPhones after all (or, at least, for all iPhones without a Secure Enclave).

This EFF article has a couple more points[1].

[1]: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2016/02/technical-perspective-...

Re: Bill Gates Says Apple Should Unlock the iPhone

#30

Post by chroma »

abpavel wrote: post #17

Bill Gates: "Let's say the bank had tied a ribbon round the disk drive and said 'don't make me cut this ribbon because you'll make me cut it many times'" ...Well, that sums up his understanding of the the encryption technology. Then what are we to expect of the general public, when even Bill Gates sees a "ribbon around a disk drive"?

I thought it was quite clear that Gates was making an analogy for non-technical readers. He doesn't really think of encrypted devices that way.

Unfortunately, there's no way Gates can win here. If he uses technical language, journalists and/or readers won't understand. Or worse: they'll misunderstand his views. If he uses simplistic analogies, he invites mockery from technical readers.

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