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Why I'm Moving My Business From San Francisco To St. Louis

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Re: Why I'm Moving My Business From San Francisco To St. Louis

#191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Italian for "grilled chees" is actually "formaggio arrosto". "panini" is just the plural of "panino", ie, a sandwich.

It's a joke... I'm surprised at the lack of imagination from the four guys above.

Well, perhaps it's just difficult to understand it as a joke when you used the word "panini" all your life!

Re: Why I'm Moving My Business From San Francisco To St. Louis

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a joke... I'm surprised at the lack of imagination from the four guys above.

Well, perhaps it's just difficult to understand it as a joke when you used the word "panini" all your life!

Ok, I'll give you a pass if you are from Italy, for example. However, the story was about the Bay Area... and growing up in California I noticed a trend that exploded about 10 years ago.

Fancy, casual restaurants stopped selling sandwiches and "grilled-cheese", upgraded the bread, and started calling them Panini. The price was also increased by $5 dollars/per for a marginally better product.

Coffee has had a similar retail transformation.

Re: Why I'm Moving My Business From San Francisco To St. Louis

#193
post #77
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People have been saying for decades that NYC is unsustainable, yet it's still the center of the country for finance. San Francisco could well become the next New York: software engineers getting paid $300k/year and talking about how they're not really "rich" because they can't even afford to buy a 2 bedroom condo.

Or it could become the next Detroit when the tech industry decides that it doesn't "need" to be in the Bay Area. I doubt that there'll be that dramatic a change because there are too many actors, Detroit was more vulnerable because it depended on such a small number of anchor employers

The car industry didn't move from Detroit. The work got automated away and growth got captured by foreign competitors. If that happened to finance, New York would suffer the same fate. But by the time robots can program themselves, all bets are off anyway.

Re: Why I'm Moving My Business From San Francisco To St. Louis

#194

if i had a business based in SF and wanted to move, i would move to west LA. actually, i already did that, years ago. SF is a pain in the ass to live in, even if you have lots of money.

How do you like West LA so far?

i live in santa monica, which in my mind is like an improved san francisco, and an improved los angeles, combined. i can always see a tiny twinge of jealousy when i tell current-SFers that i live in SM now. :)

it's not perfect but it's good for me. i have an amazing view from both home and the office, i can walk OR drive OR cab to get food/coffee/clothes/entertainment, and have access to the rest of LA if i choose to leave the sm/westside bubble.

Re: Why I'm Moving My Business From San Francisco To St. Louis

#195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Housing costs in WA can't hold a candle to Texas. The median home price in King County (where Seattle is located, for those who are unaware) is $415,000. Median home price in Dallas County is just a tad under $200,000. To get that in King County, you have to be all the way down in Federal Way or Auburn, both of which are so far out you'll need a car (so you get to sit on IH-5 for days) and you might as well not even…

415k is median...federal way and auburn are still below that. You can do better than ok with $400k in Seattle if you are willing to go condo. Texas has bad schools, high Crome, dumpster divers everywhere. Washington state is a first world country in comparison. Even some boondocks place like Spokane where houses still go for $150k compares well to Texas (though the tech jobs are all in Seattle).

Texas has simultaneously some of the best and worst schools everywhere, like most states. I spent two years in a CA high school and two years in a TX high school and the difference was worlds apart—the CA school was a joke. Falling apart, horrid teachers paid below the poverty line, huge drug and violence issues. All AP classes have been cut.

The Texas school, conversely, was a palace of education. Better in every way. Highly-paid teachers, actual funding for extracurriculars, buildings that weren't condemned. Four years of computer science classes.

Are there bad schools in Texas? Absolutely. But the fact is (unfair as it may be) that in the areas a software developer is likely to live, the schools are fantastic.

Re: Why I'm Moving My Business From San Francisco To St. Louis

#196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Housing costs in WA can't hold a candle to Texas. The median home price in King County (where Seattle is located, for those who are unaware) is $415,000. Median home price in Dallas County is just a tad under $200,000. To get that in King County, you have to be all the way down in Federal Way or Auburn, both of which are so far out you'll need a car (so you get to sit on IH-5 for days) and you might as well not even…

415k is median...federal way and auburn are still below that. You can do better than ok with $400k in Seattle if you are willing to go condo. Texas has bad schools, high Crome, dumpster divers everywhere. Washington state is a first world country in comparison. Even some boondocks place like Spokane where houses still go for $150k compares well to Texas (though the tech jobs are all in Seattle).

My point was that "better than OK with $400k" will get you a mansion in Dallas' northern suburbs or a very nice rambler with a pool inside Dallas itself, not a condo with an $800/mo maintenance fee. I'm not bagging on condos, either, but not everyone wants to live in one, plus the better ones in Seattle are getting picky about who can buy. It floored me to see an ad for a condo saying "no dogs." (Who bans dogs in Seattle? That has to be a recipe for disaster.)

You're 100% right that you can find cheaper housing in Auburn, Federal Way (mind the gunshots), Everett, or even Spokane. The problem is that living in none of those places gets you the walkable, diverse lifestyle of being in Seattle.

Also, thanks for painting all Texas schools with such a broad brush. I graduated from a north Texas (public, non-charter) high school that is well-ranked, in addition to graduating from a state college for my CSCI degree. My siblings came after me through the same school, one as recently as 5 years ago, and none of us are drooling founts of stupidity who can barely sign our own names. It's almost as though different areas have different levels of achievement in their schools.

Re: Why I'm Moving My Business From San Francisco To St. Louis

#197
post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Panino is Italian for sandwich, it literally means small bread. Panini is something I first experienced in France, where it's made with a special semi-raw bread. I've never seen anything quite like it in Italy, though.

I'll bite: panini is simply the plural of panino.

Grammatically, yes. But it's really a different type of sandwich outside of Italy.

Re: Why I'm Moving My Business From San Francisco To St. Louis

#198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

415k is median...federal way and auburn are still below that. You can do better than ok with $400k in Seattle if you are willing to go condo. Texas has bad schools, high Crome, dumpster divers everywhere. Washington state is a first world country in comparison. Even some boondocks place like Spokane where houses still go for $150k compares well to Texas (though the tech jobs are all in Seattle).

My point was that "better than OK with $400k" will get you a mansion in Dallas' northern suburbs or a very nice rambler with a pool inside Dallas itself, not a condo with an $800/mo maintenance fee. I'm not bagging on condos, either, but not everyone wants to live in one, plus the better ones in Seattle are getting picky about who can buy. It floored me to see an ad for a condo saying "no dogs." (Who bans dogs in Sea…

$800/month in maintenance fees? Are you joking or exaggerating, or are you trying to justify your McMansion preference with hyperbole?

My experience of Texas was all in Austin, maybe that is a lower end city compared to Dallas? Not sure, but I was amazed by the poverty versus the worst places I know of in Washington state (where I'm native).

Re: Why I'm Moving My Business From San Francisco To St. Louis

#199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point was that "better than OK with $400k" will get you a mansion in Dallas' northern suburbs or a very nice rambler with a pool inside Dallas itself, not a condo with an $800/mo maintenance fee. I'm not bagging on condos, either, but not everyone wants to live in one, plus the better ones in Seattle are getting picky about who can buy. It floored me to see an ad for a condo saying "no dogs." (Who bans dogs in Sea…

$800/month in maintenance fees? Are you joking or exaggerating, or are you trying to justify your McMansion preference with hyperbole? My experience of Texas was all in Austin, maybe that is a lower end city compared to Dallas? Not sure, but I was amazed by the poverty versus the worst places I know of in Washington state (where I'm native).

I have looked at this condo, right here:

http://www.seattlecondohunt.com/listing/577299-1711-e-olive-...

$554/mo in HOA and they're currently running a $210/mo "special assessment" for some recent upgrades. Almost everything on Capitol Hill is in the same boat. A condo in Issaquah had $325/mo for the HOA and another $300/mo to put in a new pool. I'm not sure why condos in Puget Sound love their special assessments but they sure do.

HOAs in north Texas that aren't considered "luxury" wouldn't dream of asking for more than a few hundred bucks a year. $254k gets you a newly-renovated 4bed/2bath half a block from the Capitol Hill-like Bishop Arts district in Dallas, a straight shot into downtown, transit, and no HOA: http://www.redfin.com/TX/Dallas/720-Elsbeth-St-75208/home/30...

We're the inverse: I'm a native of Texas and moved to Washington State. Seattle is awesome but it's very, very expensive compared to where I came from. Seattle has a lot to offer that Dallas doesn't, like weather that isn't incredibly unbearable and politicians that aren't incredibly unthinking, and scenery that isn't incredibly uninteresting. Trying to compare the two on price? Not in the same ballpark.

(The worst place I know of in King County is Federal Way and Austin was worse than that? Damn, the place has gone downhill a LOT since I was there.)

Re: Why I'm Moving My Business From San Francisco To St. Louis

#200
post #18

The current San Francisco influx is unsustainable. If you're somewhere else in the world and thinking about coming here to do a startup, I wish I could convince you to change your mind. San Francisco is incredibly expensive. Rents have shot up by ~50% since 2008, office space is following the same trend, and competition for (even mediocre) programmers is intense. Worse, a lot of the cultural diversity that made San F…

Excellent comment.
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