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Melatonin

gwern.net

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191–200 of 229 posts

Re: Melatonin

#191

Post by smokey_the_bear »

meepmorp wrote: post #109
smokey_the_bear wrote: post #106

I used to have a wildly erratic sleep schedule. Then I had a baby. Now I sleep from 10 pm to 7 am every single night. While I know a lot of people have sleep disorders, I think a lot of people have bad sleep schedules simply because they can.

I assume your child is grown up, because 10 hrs of sleep a night for someone with an infant is absurd. And unfair.

He's 12 months, and I am absurdly lucky he has slept from 8:30 pm - 7 am since 7 months. He is really intensely physical at all times while awake, which I think wears him out.

Re: Melatonin

#192

Post by hexley »

tedks wrote: post #127
ChristianMarks wrote: post #114

Gwern comes close to suggesting filtering blue light, but I will repeat a previous post. I've tried melatonin, but it is no substitute for for filtering blue light in my experience, and it tends to induce horrific, apocalyptic nightmares (granted, a night dreaming of EAS Emergency Action Notifications is better than no sleep at all). I used to be an owl for years--decades. A regular 9-5 schedule seemed out of reach.…

> it tends to induce horrific, apocalyptic nightmares I've used melatonin for years, as have many of my friends and family, and I've never had anyone mention this. I've always had more vivid dreams with melatonin, but I've never had nightmares.

I have had problems with chronic insomnia and tried melatonin — horrible nightmares. So bad I would lay awake in the morning a bit, just stunned at how horrible they were. No thanks.

Re: Melatonin

#193

Post by markeroon »

patrickdavey wrote: post #161

I had been taking concentrated cherry juice which is high in natural meltonin.. made no discernible difference to me.. so I will try to see if melatonin tablets are available here (in New Zealand) and give it a go. One thing I would love to know is (I may have missed it in the article) is whether melatonin supplements help with staying asleep. I fall asleep just fine (10-15 minutes, often earlier) but it's when my br…

This is my problem too, and it normally happens when I am highly strung. I have had success with meditation, but during very stressful periods I still tend to awaken at 4am.

Re: Melatonin

#194

Post by melatoned »

What no one is talking about but should know:

Melatonin is amazing for people that smoke weed. If you're one of those people that casually smoke but wake up the next morning feeling groggy and out of sync, take melatonin at night as directed in this article and other places. Getting into your bed will feel amazing. You will drift off to sleep, even if your iPad or music is on. And you will wake up like a normal person, except a bit more relaxed. As I became more and more successful I smoked less and less because of how it affected my performance the next day. With Melatonin I can smoke like Sophomore in college enjoying Adult Swim on a Sunday for the first time.

What no one else is talking about:

Melatonin can make you super constipated. Eat fiber, take fiber pills, eat a balanced diet high in vegetables and it should else. If you're on a neckbeard died, say goodbye to pooping regularly and when you do, it will be compact.

Re: Melatonin

#196

Post by WalterSear »

jobu wrote: post #98

My youngest daughter is borderline ADHD, and rather than trying Ritalin we've been using Melatonin in the evenings to help ease the bedtime process. (In the hopes that more sleep will help her cope with problems focusing.) The change has been dramatic. Previously it was a 3-4 hour battle each night for her to get ready for bed and stay in bed. Now with 3mg of Melatonin she spontaneously decides to get ready for bed h…

3mg is a very large dose, particularly for a child.

I take 0.5 mg myself.

Re: Melatonin

#197

Post by Sunlis »

Given that this is a naturally-occurring hormone, is there any chance that taking Melatonin regularly could cause your body to "get lazy" and eventually produce less of its own?

Re: Melatonin

#198

Post by lfuller »

ChristianMarks wrote: post #114

Gwern comes close to suggesting filtering blue light, but I will repeat a previous post. I've tried melatonin, but it is no substitute for for filtering blue light in my experience, and it tends to induce horrific, apocalyptic nightmares (granted, a night dreaming of EAS Emergency Action Notifications is better than no sleep at all). I used to be an owl for years--decades. A regular 9-5 schedule seemed out of reach.…

I'm glad someone else mentioned this. I have delayed sleep phase syndrome, which melatonin helps with, but the horrible, traumatizing nightmares make it unbearable and unusable.

Re: Melatonin

#199

Post by trefk »

I didn't see any citations for his claim that melatonin saves you an hour sleep per night. His entire argument is premised on this, but he barely discusses it - he just states it as a fact. Did I just miss something? Is there research supporting this claim?

Re: Melatonin

#200

Post by pesenti »

gwern wrote: post #170
pesenti wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how do you claim to calculate expected value here? You are making the same error he is by ignoring the possible "black swan", which, with every drug, can have dramatic consequences. A positive but cautious conclusion like http://www.vanderbilt.edu/AnS/psychology/health_psychology/m... would have been much more appropriate.

> You are making the same error he is by ignoring the possible "black swan", which, with every drug, can have dramatic consequences. The black swan is a pretty useless concept at this point, because people like you will drag it out against anything they dislike. You cannot give any rigorous formulation or evidence for it, and the best you can do is drag out some old example like thalidomide.

No rigorous formulation? The black swan has a very simple mathematical model: an unlikely event with an effect so great that it will affect the expected value. For example, a greater risk of dying after 20 or 30 years of use - which has not yet been studied. In your calculation of ROI you completely ignore unknown long term effects.

Yes it's hard and often impossible to quantify black swans. But keeping them in mind is a way to avoid overconfident articles like the one you wrote.

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