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Palantir Wants to Reinstate the Draft
191–200 of 252 posts
Re: Palantir Wants to Reinstate the Draft
#192Earlier quoted context omitted.
It also implies that most normal work isn't in the interest of society, which if that were true, would be a major problem on its own. In what sense is 2 years of military service or "community service" strictly better for society than going to school, or working as a waiter, or starting a small business?
Roughly speaking, 2 years of community service should be worth some % of local & federal taxes. In a developed society, I'm not sure what kind of labor an 18-year old can perform (what I mean is that it would be mostly unskilled labor), that would be better than taxing this same individual later in life, without delaying their education by 2 years. I suppose there would have to be exemptions for college students as t…
Shouldn't be. Just have a more-level playing field, make everyone (college-track or not) participate.
You seem to assume that tax dollars are equivalent to labor. A pile of quarters never did anything sitting there, it takes a human to do something for the most part. Money is a tool sitting there, not actual work.
Re: Palantir Wants to Reinstate the Draft
#193Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is very much anecdotal but the concept of fragging has gone mainstream in my social media feeds. Mostly gen z joking about ww3 when the Iran conflict kicked off
What is fragging?
Situation: you are a poor draftee being led by some other kid who happens to have a college degree (an officer). There are several of you, and one of him. Your living conditions are terrible and you're often asked to do things that might get you killed, and all of the reasons you're told you have to do this sure smell like bullshit.
Solution: you make your officer (another kid) piss-pants scared that if he doesn't lie and say you all totally went on that combat patrol you were sent on (rather than hanging around in the woods somewhere relatively safe for a couple hours, then walking right back to base) he might go to bed and not wake up because someone tossed a hand grenade in his tent and killed him. Or if he confiscates your drugs or hooch. Or tries to enforce grooming standards. Or anything else that makes your life worse. Basically, make him deathly afraid of upsetting "his men" in any way.
Grenades were the threat/weapon of choice because one tossed into a tent was pretty damn certain to kill the person sleeping there; deploying a grenade is very quiet (up until the boom, of course); they're much smaller than a firearm (easier to conceal even than a service pistol); and the slight delay between throw and detonation gave time to get some distance. In practice, it turned out to be extremely hard to prove who had committed these murders, especially if others in the unit weren't inclined to be honest about things they'd seen and heard that night.
This was A Thing toward the later end of the Vietnam War, and contributed mightily to reduced effectiveness of US ground forces. Turns out when you threaten people with death for no good reason they get kinda pissed off and murdery.
"Fragging" comes from "fragmentation grenade", or "frag" for short.
Re: Palantir Wants to Reinstate the Draft
#194Other countries have compulsory military service, for example Finland. Generally speaking I am a fan of the idea that everyone should be required to do some kind of community service for 2 years once they turn 18. Military service would just be one option, could be other kinds of civic engagement. This can really help people feel connected to their society and understand that there is something to show up for. BUT -…
> Generally speaking I am a fan of the idea that everyone should be required to do some kind of community service for 2 years once they turn 18. Why? I get the warm-and-fuzzy angle of "instilling civic responsibility", but you're effectively instilling that at gunpoint: the government forces you to do this, else you go to prison. Is that really such an enlightened thing to do? It takes away two years of your life, po…
Do you believe that in American civil society there are only privileges and not responsibilities?
Government already got the tax dollars to pay for the service at gunpoint. And makes you get a passport to travel internationally or a driver's license to get yourself around at gunpoint.
Re: Palantir Wants to Reinstate the Draft
#195Other countries have compulsory military service, for example Finland. Generally speaking I am a fan of the idea that everyone should be required to do some kind of community service for 2 years once they turn 18. Military service would just be one option, could be other kinds of civic engagement. This can really help people feel connected to their society and understand that there is something to show up for. BUT -…
When's the last time Finland or Switzerland attacked or invaded another country? People are willing to engage in compulsory military service if they feel that it's truly meant to help the country defend itself from actual attack, not potentially being shipped off somewhere to serve some political or economic goal.
> When's the last time Finland or Switzerland attacked or invaded another country?
Not recently to my knowledge, but Finland has extensive experience being invaded given they are neighbors with Russia (and Sweden in the past). When your next door neighbor keeps seeing your country as "their property," you need means to push them back.
Re: Palantir Wants to Reinstate the Draft
#196Earlier quoted context omitted.
In the conventional view, the earliest preparations for war involve building a strong industrial base, reducing corruption, and securing alliances through cooperative foreign policy. The near-term preparations for war include diverting a fraction of total resources away from compounding growth and towards non-compounding defense manufacturing. A draft is something you do after the war starts. The strategic idea is to…
There are other bases besides war for national service, eg disaster prep, taking care of the poor and so on. In any case, being somewhat prepared for war at the human level and understanding what that entails is more productive that not being prepared and having to educate people in an unwelcome emergency. The same goes for replacing the first two years of professional school with standing around in a big shed. Exagg…
One of the paradoxes of military service is that the real experiences of servicemembers sound exaggerated, while what sounds like reality is expressed through Hollywood tropes.
Re: Palantir Wants to Reinstate the Draft
#197Earlier quoted context omitted.
Finland doesn't have compulsory military service to help people feel connected to their society. Feeling connected to one's society is not an end in itself, people should be free to choose how connected they want to feel. Finland has compulsory military service because it's a small country that borders Russia. The US is a big country that borders Canada and Mexico.
> people should be free to choose how connected they want to feel Yes and no. Of course people should be free, at the same time you live in a society and not a state of nature. If someone never has to put back into society, that's dangerous. It could lead to people feeling that society has no value, that there's no sense in investing in it, that since nobody else cares why should I. That's not a world I want to live…
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Re: Palantir Wants to Reinstate the Draft
#198I thought we were supposed to have autonomous killer robots. What do we need a draft for?
The question isn't what do we need a draft for, we don't.
The question is: Who would profit from a draft? Answer: Panatir.
Re: Palantir Wants to Reinstate the Draft
#199Earlier quoted context omitted.
Finland doesn't have compulsory military service to help people feel connected to their society. Feeling connected to one's society is not an end in itself, people should be free to choose how connected they want to feel. Finland has compulsory military service because it's a small country that borders Russia. The US is a big country that borders Canada and Mexico.
> people should be free to choose how connected they want to feel Yes and no. Of course people should be free, at the same time you live in a society and not a state of nature. If someone never has to put back into society, that's dangerous. It could lead to people feeling that society has no value, that there's no sense in investing in it, that since nobody else cares why should I. That's not a world I want to live…
> If someone never has to put back into society, that's dangerous.
Most people I meet and interact with in the United States already feel like they don't need to contribute anything back into society besides the taxes they already pay to the local and federal government.
And what I mean by that is that some of them may SAY they would like to contribute, but none of them actually do (beyond taxes).
Re: Palantir Wants to Reinstate the Draft
#200Other countries have compulsory military service, for example Finland. Generally speaking I am a fan of the idea that everyone should be required to do some kind of community service for 2 years once they turn 18. Military service would just be one option, could be other kinds of civic engagement. This can really help people feel connected to their society and understand that there is something to show up for. BUT -…
One of the many issues with this supposedly being for everyone is that rich folks like Donald Trump's dad will get a doctor to get them out of it. Rules for thee and not for me is basically their motto.
One of the benefits of it being some form of civil service and not specifically military service is that it eliminates large categories of medical exemptions from being relevant.