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I've sold out

mariozechner.at

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Re: I've sold out

#191

Post by aryehof »

tasuki wrote: post #96
raincole wrote: post #82

Mario having to write this many words to justify this decision alone is a red flag already. The fact I can't understand what Earendil is after reading this many words is an even bigger red flag. But who am I to judge? If I made a project as popular as pi I'd sell out so fast.

> The fact I can't understand what Earendil is after reading this many words is an even bigger red flag. Same, but I heard about Armin Ronacher, and the things I heard were not exactly terrible. He's the creator of the Flask microframework, he's contributed to open source more than most people. Perhaps it'll be fine! And, as Mario has written about ten times in his post: Pi is MIT licensed and it's not hard to find t…

To quote Ronacher - “Earendil is a venture-backed for-profit, public benefit corporation”

Their intention to release products that provide a return for their backers, using a “free with paid premium” model.

Re: I've sold out

#192

Post by aryehof »

latexr wrote: post #20
collabs wrote: post #8

> The one thing that differentiated Armin from other internet trolls was the way he conducted himself in these heated discussions. He was never emotional or aggressive. Our discussions would either end in cordial disagreement, or a newfound common understanding. That's extremely rare on the internet. Ah haha so armin is also an Internet troll, right? For example if I said, one thing that sets the "Concorde apart from…

Another one is: > Colin is pretty OK for an ex-finance dude Making it look like the author disapproves of finance dudes but finds Colin tolerable yet still within the expected parameters of badness.

> “Earendil is a venture-backed for-profit, public benefit corporation” - Ronacher

The author favors the “public benefit” part, but less so the “venture-backed for-profit” part, is my speculation. Likely the reason for the disapproval of the finance types and the title “I’ve sold out”.

Re: I've sold out

#193

Post by deaux »

the_mitsuhiko wrote: post #158
deaux wrote: post #46

This is so disappointing. Finally we had a fantastic, fully OSS, non-profit harness. Very extensible, well-made, minimal, untainted. None of the baggage of OpenCode both in terms of codebase as well as its.. "passionate" leadership, to put it mildly. > Earendil is a public benefit corporation Ah, so like OpenAI then. > But I've also learned what I do not want. I do not want to build my own company around pi. We have…

Armin from Earendil: At the end of the day there is nothing I can demonstrate to you now that we will be doing a good job here. But I want to be able to put back at comments like this in a few years and be able to demonstrate that we made the right calls for everybody involved.

Please do provr me wrong! I closed with the "you don't owe us anything" because I mean it, not to hedge. Even if it goes wrong, I don't think Mario is a bad guy, neither are you!

It has just become impossible to believe this kind of thing unless IMO the post is even more transparent than this. That was my point, if you really do mean the best and want to show that to the world, then even this (while much more transparent than anything with investor involvement) I don't think reaches the bar. So that's something I think that could've been done to demonstrate that this was a good call.

If you can demonstrate a few years from now that my disappointment was unwarranted, then everyone's a winner :)

Re: I've sold out

#194

Post by wiseowise »

NitpickLawyer wrote: post #108
dust42 wrote: post #77

Context: Mario Zechner is the creator of the pi coding harness which powers OpenClaw. OpenClaw is made by Peter Steinberger, a friend of Mario Zechner. Armin is another friend who made public that OpenClaw is based on pi. Pi itself is a minimalist coding harness with a tiny 1500 token system message and only read, edit and bash as tools. I only discovered it a few weeks ago and it is surprisingly powerful with a loca…

> who made public that OpenClaw is based on pi. I haven't kept up with the various claw stuff, but isn't openclaw the one under MIT on github? What does "made public" mean in this context?

Bold of you to assume OpenClaw users can read or browse source code of something.

Re: I've sold out

#195

Post by tasuki »

meowface wrote: post #184
Jgrubb wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I switched about a month ago, looked back once for about 10 minutes and decided I'm officially done w CC. I didn't realize what a dull knife CC is until I tried a really sharp one, and that's Pi.

Can you elaborate? I want a maximalist setup. I like that CC and Codex are maximalist. If I install Pi, I am going to end up using oh-my-pi and installing a trillion plugins to get a Claude Code-like experience (or better/more feature-heavy). Is there any point in me even trying Pi, or should I just stick with Claude Code?

> I want a maximalist setup.

> Is there any point in me even trying Pi, or should I just stick with Claude Code?

I'd say stick with Claude Code. I'm a minimalist and hate everything about Claude Code!

Re: I've sold out

#196

Post by AlexeyBelov »

rvz wrote: post #149
kator wrote: post #80

I think it's a bit sad that we often say people "Sold out". Sometimes, I agree, but often, I point out that until the lady at the grocery store stops asking me for money when I walk up to check out, I need to pay my bills to eat. I contribute to open source projects, but none of them to date could support me buying much more than a beer. If one took off such that I could "live" off it, I would be happy to leave my cu…

You are allowed to make money. Do not listen to others who say that you cannot, because they can't themselves.

There are different ways to make money though. For example, being a grifter is not cool.

Re: I've sold out

#197

Post by mark_l_watson »

girvo wrote: post #188
mark_l_watson wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you are suggesting might sound difficult to some people, it is possible: in the last week I co-wrote (with Antigravity with Claude as the backend) an Emacs package for agentic coding that also just uses ‘rg’ for finding relevant code for the context, call out to a model, and handle creating a diff with merging tools. I love using my own code that provides inside Emacs vibe coding and I would suggest others try b…

Exactly! The actual base loop of these agents is remarkably simple. https://github.com/girvo/girvent this is my silly one :)

looks nice!

Re: I've sold out

#199

Post by Jgrubb »

meowface wrote: post #184
Jgrubb wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I switched about a month ago, looked back once for about 10 minutes and decided I'm officially done w CC. I didn't realize what a dull knife CC is until I tried a really sharp one, and that's Pi.

Can you elaborate? I want a maximalist setup. I like that CC and Codex are maximalist. If I install Pi, I am going to end up using oh-my-pi and installing a trillion plugins to get a Claude Code-like experience (or better/more feature-heavy). Is there any point in me even trying Pi, or should I just stick with Claude Code?

Sorry I'm late but stick with CC. I introduced a coworker to Pi and spent most of the morning feeling like I should apologize for it not doing this or that out of the box.

Re: I've sold out

#200

Post by jmaw »

infecto wrote: post #162
jmaw wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been considering playing around with opencode. Can you expand on what you mean by this?

The harness or the tool is ok but all the defaults as part of the paid pieces of the tool have really bad privacy decisions. So they offer Zen as a pay as you use credit system with access to the models they think work best with the harness. Their own stealth model in it along with a number of the leading new models are always-on sharing data for training purposes. They don’t make this immediately obvious either you…

Gotcha, thanks. That is a bit sus
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