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ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

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Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#191

Post by enaaem »

jacquesm wrote: post #145
riazrizvi wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a brown immigrant, the process to get into the US legally was long. I trust US institutions to have good intent, but like all institutions they fail at times. The mandate is to remove 25 million illegal migrants. I reject the hostile posture that people are taking based on negatively biased information, which in my view, further reassures me they are acting in Americans' best interest. I care because my children…

Do you honestly believe that when they're done with the illegal immigrants they're not going to come for the 'brown people in general'?

They will come after “domestic terrorists”.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#192

Post by elnatro »

frumplestlatz wrote: post #131
_DeadFred_ wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that the 'police don't need to identify themselves and should wear face masks' or the 'you aren't allowed to film the police because it interferes with our trying to be a secret police force' laws? Or the 'you aren't doing anything illegal but the masked government agents don't like it so they are going to use your biometrics to harass you in whatever ways the feds can make your life more difficult' laws?

[flagged]

Does that law allow killing them by shooting? I suppose that officers need to detain them, read their rights, and put them in court. That’s what I thought was the core of the American Law.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#193

Post by donkeybeer »

runsWphotons wrote: post #108
elnatro wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please, enlighten me a non-American, what laws allow shooting and killing civilians on broad light on the USA?

When an officer has reasonable suspicion that a civilian poses a threat to his life, he can shoot them. Once police start shooting they are trained to continue shooting until the target is incapacitated. That's the law. Whether the recent shootings you saw meet that standard is up for debate.

Absolutely, likewise we should shoot ICE officers who come near us because we have strong precedent they are mentally unstable and prone to psychotic bouts of insensate violence. Since we have more than reasonable suspicion of threat to our life.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#194

Post by donkeybeer »

frumplestlatz wrote: post #131
_DeadFred_ wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that the 'police don't need to identify themselves and should wear face masks' or the 'you aren't allowed to film the police because it interferes with our trying to be a secret police force' laws? Or the 'you aren't doing anything illegal but the masked government agents don't like it so they are going to use your biometrics to harass you in whatever ways the feds can make your life more difficult' laws?

[flagged]

Minnesota is a castle doctrine state. Minnesotans have the right to shoot at violent home invaders on their property.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#195

Post by donkeybeer »

golem14 wrote: post #105
cess11 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What complexity is it you'd like to add?

For instance, the local cops checking in on grandma, or those checking in on a troubled child are really not the bad guys. You WANT them when you need them. Not all LEOs are brown shirts, In my experience, few are, but they give the lot a bad rap. Treating LEOs uniformly as evil is just counterproductive

Yes but I don't have a definitive map of who are the good ones, so we must treat it as a life or death situation and suitably defend ourselves in an interaction with any of them.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#196

Post by potamic »

stephantul wrote: post #20

This has bean a long time coming. This is a stark reminder that you should consider who the future stewards of whatever you are building might be. We built a vast surveillance network under the guise of servings ads and making money, and lost track of how this power could be abused by an entity not aligned with our own values.

There was a narrative here earlier that I'd rather trust Google/Apple with my data than any other company or any government. The end result is the same in the end. When it comes to privacy, the only thing that works is zero trust.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#197

Post by jacquesm »

surgical_fire wrote: post #174
RGamma wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Atomization enables this. Any number of individuals are individually weak against their employer/some org, but a big group of them can be quite powerful. If many were to sacrifice their morals out of financial pressure easily (the control over which is in increasingly few hands) the path the US is treading becomes pretty deterministic... We've seen it in the movies and read it in the books. You guys seem to need coll…

> You guys One of the reasons I chose to move to Europe is because I value the mininal safety nets and labor protections on this side of the pond. Yes, I make less money and pay more taxes but I believe this is how society should work, I reject the hyper individualism that ignores any sort of collective. But I am also not naive. Expecting individuals to take the burden for decisions way beyond their control is silly.…

The best way to evaluate any society is to look at what happens to people without power in the system. Inmates, illegals, the poor and children.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#198

Post by jacquesm »

Kim_Bruning wrote: post #189
surgical_fire wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If that's the case, great then. I did work for a company I find morally objectionable in the past (i.e.: evil), and I eventually found my way out. At the time I was still paying rent and needed employment to keep my visa. I also had little savings, and an ill parent that depended on me. I certainly couldn't take the principled stance of "fuck this, I'm out". My point is that if you are in the position to take a princ…

I sympathize with your situation, and I'm not calling you a monster. But "I had no choice, I had people depending on me" is the exact reasoning that has enabled every atrocity carried out by ordinary people; it's the banality of evil. None of the individual acts seem evil. Conducting a census isn't evil. Collating the data isn't evil. Arresting people with the wrong papers isn't necessarily evil. Driving a train isn'…

> That's a famous Vernichtungslager, and that's not true yet.

But it may well become true soon.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#199

Post by throwawayqqq11 »

Paracompact wrote: post #158
xp84 wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if we believe that those shootings are completely unacceptable (probably criminal), but that “have no immigration enforcement and permanently halt deportations” is also unacceptable? The latter seems to be the solution being pushed by one party. Like always, the left’s problem is that their proposed solutions read like they were written by teenagers, based on emotions and dismissive of the reasons why their supp…

Years ago, I would have agreed with most of what you wrote. The left, like the right, reacts with emotion and absolutism. No one is above this, so I think it is very important that we frequently assess what would actually change our minds. Given the present tide of things, however, I think there's no amount of course-correction back toward the left that would prove excessive. My opinion on this will change as soon as…

> a leftist president endorses indiscriminate murder of ICE agents

Comparing the rhetoric today, this might never happen. There are qualitative differences between both political geoups, so grouping them together as a single horseshoe is 'unhelpful for analysis'.

That said, you cant fully rule out leftist led atrocities aswell and maybe thats the reason why the right is escalating in violent rhetoric, they want this as a self fullfilling prophecy to justify more violence.

When Kirk was shot, all the "this needs to stop" commentary, as if it was an organized mass phenomenon, was sending shivers down my spine. We all know how the far right envisions stopping this 'mass' violence.

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