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Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

donutlab.com

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Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#191

Post by cosmic_cheese »

gilbetron wrote: post #187
cosmic_cheese wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even as things currently stand, some folks just have a bone to pick with EVs. Even if future models have an 800mi range, can charge to 100% in 5 minutes, and have useful lifetimes as long or longer than ICE counterparts, some will figure out some reason to get angry about them.

I emphasize, somewhat, with them for some complaints. The thing I love about our EV is the greatly reduced maintenance. No oil changes, no transmission fluid changes, greatly less parts means less that can fail, etc. That's awesome, but it also means people in industries supporting those will see their industries reduce or go away. This is good for us overall, but is painful for those in the midst. That's why there i…

The tail on the move to electric is going to be quite long. It’s accelerating, but I doubt it’ll ever get to the point of radical overnight change. There will still be ICE (or hybrid) cars on the road in need of service 10, 15, 20 years from now, even if EVs become overwhelmingly advantageous, because that’s just how people work. Demand will gradually taper off and there will be opportunity for most in the industry to figure out alternative employment.

Some portion will be able to train and transition to working on EVs, too. EVs might need less maintenance generally, but things still go wrong sometimes plus people get into accidents and such. There’s also a nascent motor/battery retrofit industry that’s sprouting right now and will grow with time.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#192

Post by Electricniko »

jaggs wrote: post #164
Electricniko wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know about a scam, but the EV skateboard they're using has been available for other companies to use for a few years, while the other two companies share the same leadership as Donut/Verge and appear to be founded within the last few months. The battery may be great, but the multiple company launch seems a bit of a marketing gimmick.

not too sure of your point. The skateboard has been available with conventional lithium ion batteries. What they're saying here is they've just upgraded it to the new solid state ones. Fairly logical.And I'm totally mystified by the shared leadership comment. What shared leadership?

According to press releases, the CEO of Donut/Verge founded Cova and ESOX in October/November. They're newly formed companies that haven't done anything yet, so I don't really think it would require much sophistication to say that three companies have already adopted this technology. Again, this doesn't say anything about the "realness" of the battery technology, I just wouldn't rely on the idea that multiple companies adopting it means that the technology is real, since right now it's tending to look more like businessmen throwing out multiple shell startups in different industries to lend weight to the announcement.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#193

Post by Workaccount2 »

ninkendo wrote: post #178
Workaccount2 wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The biggest issue is that people think EV's are gas cars that have electricity instead of gasoline, with the main difference being you have to sit at the "gas pump" for 45 minutes instead of 2. But the way you daily an EV is totally different than a gas car, and even the way you travel is totally different. People have no concept of EV ownership, so they just go with the gas model that they know. But it is totally in…

> The biggest issue is that people think EV's are gas cars that have electricity instead of gasoline, with the main difference being you have to sit at the "gas pump" for 45 minutes instead of 2. If you don’t live in a conventional house with access to overnight charging, this is exactly what EV’s are. But we keep talking down to people like this, as if every non-EV owner must just be stupid or something.

We're not speaking down to people like that, we are telling them they are not part of the conversation. You really shouldn't get an EV if you cannot plug in overnight.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#194

Post by testing22321 »

cosmic_cheese wrote: post #81
1970-01-01 wrote: post #68

So solid state battery tech is very likely on-schedule for mass production over the next 4 years. There really isn't much time left for the haters to post stories attempting to factually dismantle and dismiss EVs before EVs pass the 51% adoption curve in 2030.

Even as things currently stand, some folks just have a bone to pick with EVs. Even if future models have an 800mi range, can charge to 100% in 5 minutes, and have useful lifetimes as long or longer than ICE counterparts, some will figure out some reason to get angry about them.

Can’t roll coal, no rumble, too hard to self repair, not “old school”, rely on foreign Mumbai jumbo, etc etc

The list is endless

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#195

Post by Workaccount2 »

VladVladikoff wrote: post #129
cosmic_cheese wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even as things currently stand, some folks just have a bone to pick with EVs. Even if future models have an 800mi range, can charge to 100% in 5 minutes, and have useful lifetimes as long or longer than ICE counterparts, some will figure out some reason to get angry about them.

If you live in the north, lithium ion batteries are not a great bet for longevity of a vehicle. There are legitimate reasons to not be pro EV in their current form.

The batteries on modern EV's have full dedicated heating and cooling systems. They will not charge until they heat up to charging temperature.

Discharging in the cold and sitting in the cold are not bad for the batteries, but it does limit available power.

Believe it or not, Canada has a robust EV market.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#196

Post by testing22321 »

zelon88 wrote: post #146
JuniperMesos wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A person I know is upset about EVs because they are built around the assumption that every system in the car will phone home to the car manufacturer (or perhaps the cops), and basically require you to have a proprietary smartphone app in order to interact with EV chargers and perhaps the car itself. Of course, this is also true of new ICE cars, but it's at least possible to continue driving an older ICE car with more…

My concerns are the computerization of vehicles in general. The issue is not entirely with the telemetry itself, as you frame it. My issue is "what happens when the telemetry is not available?" You, and perhaps your friend, seem to be framing the problem as though the concern is that the car is filled with "spyware." My issue is that the car is filled with "DRM" from the manufacturer. When I buy a car, I expect to ow…

Have you tried to fuel a ICE vehicle in a power outage? I waited a week in the Congo.

Getting fuel out of underground tanks and paying for it are non trivial with no power.

I can charge an EV off my solar panels.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#197

Post by testing22321 »

cosmic_cheese wrote: post #191
gilbetron wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I emphasize, somewhat, with them for some complaints. The thing I love about our EV is the greatly reduced maintenance. No oil changes, no transmission fluid changes, greatly less parts means less that can fail, etc. That's awesome, but it also means people in industries supporting those will see their industries reduce or go away. This is good for us overall, but is painful for those in the midst. That's why there i…

The tail on the move to electric is going to be quite long. It’s accelerating, but I doubt it’ll ever get to the point of radical overnight change. There will still be ICE (or hybrid) cars on the road in need of service 10, 15, 20 years from now, even if EVs become overwhelmingly advantageous, because that’s just how people work. Demand will gradually taper off and there will be opportunity for most in the industry t…

Just like there are still horse and carts on the road today, and steam powered locomotion.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#198

Post by testing22321 »

senordevnyc wrote: post #91
cosmic_cheese wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even as things currently stand, some folks just have a bone to pick with EVs. Even if future models have an 800mi range, can charge to 100% in 5 minutes, and have useful lifetimes as long or longer than ICE counterparts, some will figure out some reason to get angry about them.

It's fine, those folks can just get angrier and angrier as the market makes their ICE cars more and more difficult and expensive to own.

Also they’ll be dead soon enough and the world will just move on without them.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#199

Post by karmakurtisaani »

sheepscreek wrote: post #149

This is so out there, checks every box imaginable or they’ve done some incredible copy writing. So then, elephant in the room, where is the catch? It’s it the cost? They haven’t left much else - - made from geopolitically abundant resources - unlikely to catch fire - fully charges in 5 mins - does not lose capacity over cycles - retains 99% capacity at -30C and 100C What is today, April 1st??

One reason to trust this to some extent is that many car manufacturers are pushing onwards with their solid state battery tech. Youtube channel Just have a think made a video recently on the state of this tech and it does look promising.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#200

Post by cosmic_cheese »

testing22321 wrote: post #196
zelon88 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My concerns are the computerization of vehicles in general. The issue is not entirely with the telemetry itself, as you frame it. My issue is "what happens when the telemetry is not available?" You, and perhaps your friend, seem to be framing the problem as though the concern is that the car is filled with "spyware." My issue is that the car is filled with "DRM" from the manufacturer. When I buy a car, I expect to ow…

Have you tried to fuel a ICE vehicle in a power outage? I waited a week in the Congo. Getting fuel out of underground tanks and paying for it are non trivial with no power. I can charge an EV off my solar panels.

And solar is just one of many ways of generating electricity. Wind turbines continue to work, as do hydroelectric plants (and on a smaller scale, water wheels). Worst case scenario, you can burn more readily accessible carbon based fuels like wood to make steam to generate power. Vehicles that are dependent on extraction and refinement of petroleum are actually quite limited in comparison.
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