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The EU made Apple adopt new Wi-Fi standards, and now Android can support AirDrop

arstechnica.com

191–200 of 327 posts

Re: The EU made Apple adopt new Wi-Fi standards, and now Android can support AirDrop

#191
Oh, look what "over-regulation" does, forcing companies to comply to standards so they can't vendor lock-in their users (this happened with the iphone charging port too, from the apple specific port to usb-c).

Guess this type of consumer-benefic changes wouldn't happen in the land of "freedom".

Re: The EU made Apple adopt new Wi-Fi standards, and now Android can support AirDrop

#192
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple also helped develop USB C more than a decade ago, they still had to be forced to actually use it in their phones. There is no contradiction here

Apple said from the day that they made lightning cables that it would be supported for 10 years. They literally contractually guaranteed that to third party manufacturers in exchange for them creating a massive availability of cables for Apple users. The EU “forced them” to switch to the standard they helped develop (USB C) on the 11th year after developing lighting. I’m sure it was all the EUs doing.

https://www.wsj.com/video/apple-executive-on-adoption-of-usb...

Apple argues that the law was dumb environmentally due to many people having Lightning-cables that wouldn't work in the future, so they obviously can't have intended to do the same changeover at the same time as the EU forced them to

Re: The EU made Apple adopt new Wi-Fi standards, and now Android can support AirDrop

#193

Oh, look what "over-regulation" does, forcing companies to comply to standards so they can't vendor lock-in their users (this happened with the iphone charging port too, from the apple specific port to usb-c). Guess this type of consumer-benefic changes wouldn't happen in the land of "freedom".

A positive effect from regulation does not rebut the general argument against government regulation of industry.

The problem with regulation isn’t that there are never any positive effects, of course there are.

The problem is it’s impossible to reliably avoid adding substantial friction to life via overly broad regulation that is not applicable but has to be followed anyway, or outdated but still-in-effect regulation that is not applicable but has to be followed anyway, at least.

If this only bothered huge companies then I would say cost of doing business, who cares, etc, but it actually affects things like how cities and towns are designed, how expensive housing is, how expensive medical treatment is, etc.

Re: The EU made Apple adopt new Wi-Fi standards, and now Android can support AirDrop

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who is stopping someone from competing against ASML?

Who’s stopping anyone from competing with Apple? Let’s force ASML to open up its manufacturing line and cancel their patents for squandering innovation, but wait they’re an incredible company that dominated the field with their hard work and diligence, so it’s not fair for them. Similarly, the open markets should apply to everyone, not just dominant American firms. Though, I’m not saying they’re innocent and I think…

> Who’s stopping anyone from competing with Apple?

Apple's dominant market position and abuse of network effects via their proprietary standards, like the one we're talking about from this article.

> Let’s force ASML to open up its manufacturing line and cancel their patents for squandering innovation

No-one's arguing for any equivalent of that to happen to Apple. Just that when there's an open standard for inter-device communication, they should follow that. Imagine if ASML-manufactured processors wouldn't work with standard DDR5, only with some special memory chips that only ASML could manufacture, that would be the equivalent to what Apple is doing.

Apple should enjoy the profits from when they make better products that win on their merits. But they should have to compete fairly.

Re: The EU made Apple adopt new Wi-Fi standards, and now Android can support AirDrop

#195
post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, so you're a hyper capitalist. Good, I dig that. Me too. Big tech is literally a machine putting a ceiling on your ability to build. They tax and control everything, lock down distribution, prevent you from operating without rules. If you get big enough, they self-fund an internal team to compete with you. Or they offer to buy you for less than you're worth. If you don't accept, they buy your competitor. Capital…

> They tax and control everything, lock down distribution, prevent you from operating without rules. You seem to be arguing that the EU should be doing that though. What about those of us who quite like the way Apple does things right now? I'm happy to pay extra for a lot of your dot points, I quite like someone to be acting as a firewall between my device and the unfettered soup that is stuff out on the internet. Ap…

>> Apple is so successful is because they know how to create a great phone experience.

I disagree, may be they were at some time. Now they are successful because the walls of the well are so high. It is insanely difficult for us frogs to jump. Happy that governments are trying to bring those walls down

>> I am happy to pay extra for a lot of your dot points. Good for you because you trust them. Problem is I am not. I dont trust apple/google to make that decision for me. But they dont give that choice. They are making you sacrificing freedom, choice by masking them self as secure. But underlying motive is profits and control.

I heard a story that apple asked meta for comission on ads , when meta rejected they introduced features to remove access to usage metrics to 3rd party apps. If meta agreed , you might never see the privacy features app introduced.

The security you are thinking is a believable mirage. There are several users who have lost thousands of dollars to scammy appstore in app purchases/subsciptions and apple is doing shit to stop this.

Re: The EU made Apple adopt new Wi-Fi standards, and now Android can support AirDrop

#196

Oh, look what "over-regulation" does, forcing companies to comply to standards so they can't vendor lock-in their users (this happened with the iphone charging port too, from the apple specific port to usb-c). Guess this type of consumer-benefic changes wouldn't happen in the land of "freedom".

A positive effect from regulation does not rebut the general argument against government regulation of industry. The problem with regulation isn’t that there are never any positive effects, of course there are. The problem is it’s impossible to reliably avoid adding substantial friction to life via overly broad regulation that is not applicable but has to be followed anyway, or outdated but still-in-effect regulation…

Even though overly broad regulation is a risk, I don't believe little/no regulation is an option either. I don't think the US's consumer protection mechanisms work, and I'm happy to accept the downsides of the EU's systems that come with the upsides of regulation.

Re: The EU made Apple adopt new Wi-Fi standards, and now Android can support AirDrop

#197

Oh, look what "over-regulation" does, forcing companies to comply to standards so they can't vendor lock-in their users (this happened with the iphone charging port too, from the apple specific port to usb-c). Guess this type of consumer-benefic changes wouldn't happen in the land of "freedom".

A positive effect from regulation does not rebut the general argument against government regulation of industry. The problem with regulation isn’t that there are never any positive effects, of course there are. The problem is it’s impossible to reliably avoid adding substantial friction to life via overly broad regulation that is not applicable but has to be followed anyway, or outdated but still-in-effect regulation…

It's unclear exactly what you're arguing, but I think if you are arguing that, because of the unavoidable substantial friction caused by regulation, we shouldn't have any regulation of industry at all... I think it's trivial to find examples where banning all regulation of industry would make the world a much, much worse place. Much worse than the friction.

Re: The EU made Apple adopt new Wi-Fi standards, and now Android can support AirDrop

#198
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple also helped develop USB C more than a decade ago, they still had to be forced to actually use it in their phones. There is no contradiction here

Apple used USB-C on the iPhone 15 and 16 without being forced to do so. If Apple was indeed forced to use USB-C they would have postponed it to the 17. Do you also think Apple was forced to use USB-C on the iPad and MacBook?

Wow , you need lot of homework to do. You missed the whole timeline of events, backlash with apple and usbc and just looking at headlines.

Or either misrepresenting the facts because you are a fan boy of a trillion dollar company. Please dont if its latter.

Re: The EU made Apple adopt new Wi-Fi standards, and now Android can support AirDrop

#199

People keep mentioning Wi-Fi Aware with this, but so far haven't seen anyone actually prove that this is the case. Apple undoubtedly added Wi-Fi Aware support to iOS https://developer.apple.com/documentation/WiFiAware , but its not clear whether iOS actually supports AirDrop over Wi-Fi Aware. Apple clearly hasn't completely dropped AWDL for AirDrop, because you can still AirDrop from iOS 26 to earlier devices. Note t…

Apple usually gatekeeps their EU required features with a strong region lock.

If Airdrop was changed to use Wifi-Aware due to EU regulation it very likely wouldn't be enabled worldwide.

Re: The EU made Apple adopt new Wi-Fi standards, and now Android can support AirDrop

#200
post #161
post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> macOS devices, which are not listed as being supported on the Wi-Fi Aware page. Not listed, but shipped with some Wifi Aware library /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/DeviceToDeviceManager.framework/Plugins/WiFiAwareD2DPlugin.bundle

Just `tcpdump -i awdl0` while Airdrop-ing to a Mac to observe it's still using AWDL. (unless the interface named awdl0 is actually using WiFi Aware...) Another fun thing to do: `ping6 ff02::1%awdl0`. Pings all nearby Apple devices with AWDL active. Including things like your neighbor's phone that's not even on your local network. (but addresses rotate I believe so can't track persistently)

> (but addresses rotate I believe so can't track persistently)

But maybe you can infer presence tracking the response time? Could be exploited anyway, no?

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