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I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

michael.stapelberg.ch

191–200 of 370 posts

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#191
post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "Dark Rock 5" marketing materials say it provides a 210 W TDP [1] and marketers seldom under-sell their products' capabilities. So if your CPU is drawing "more than 200W" you're pretty much at the limits of your cooler. [1] https://www.bequiet.com/en/cpucooler/5110

Feels like CPU manufacturers should be at least slapping a big warning on if they're selling a CPU that draws more power than any available cooler can dissipate.

The idea is that it's for a limited time, after a period of lower-than-that cooling. In other words TDP is time-weighted.

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

M3 ultra is the more capable chip by quite a bit. For instance: 80 GPU cores versus 10 in the m4. Twice the memory bandwidth, twice the CPU core count... It's really wacky how they've decided to name things

Is there some tricky edge case here? I thought the “3” and “4” just denoted generations. The Ultra chips are like Apple’s equivalent of a workstation chip, they are always bigger right? It is like comparing the previous generation Xeon to a current gen i5.

Apple has been iterating IPC as well as increasing core count.

The Ultra is a pair of Max chips. While the core counts didn't increase from M3 to M4 Max, overall performance is in the neighborhood of 5-25% better. Which still puts the M3 Ultra as Apple's top end chip, and the M5 Max might not dethrone it either.

The uplift in IPC and core counts means that my M1 Max MBP has a similar amount of CPU performance as my M3 iPad Air.

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#193
post #115

I feel like both Intel and AMD are not doing great in the desktop CPU stability department. I made a machine with a Ryzen 9900X a while back and it had the issue that it would freeze when idling. A few years before I had a 5950X that would regularly crash under load (luckily it was a prebuilt, so it was ultimately fixed). When you do not have a bunch of components ready to swap out it is also really hard to debug the…

The M series chips aren’t the absolute fastest in raw speed, though they are toward the top of the list, but they destroy x86 lineage chips on performance per watt. I have an M1 Max, a few revisions old, and the only thing I can do to spin up the fans is run local LLMs or play Minecraft with the kids on a giant ultra wide monitor at full frame rate. Giant Rust builds and similar will barely turn on the fan. Normal st…

> they destroy x86 lineage chips on performance per watt.

This isn't really true. On the same process node the difference is negligible. It's just that Intel's process in particular has efficiency problems and Apple buys out the early capacity for TSMC's new process nodes. Then when you compare e.g. the first chips to use 3nm to existing chips which are still using 4 or 5nm, the newer process has somewhat better efficiency. But even then the difference isn't very large.

And the processors made on the same node often make for inconvenient comparisons, e.g. the M4 uses TSMC N3E but the only x86 processor currently using that is Epyc. And then you're obviously not comparing like with like, but as a ballpark estimate, the M4 Pro has a TDP of ~3.2W/core whereas Epyc 9845 is ~2.4W/core. The M4 can mitigate this by having somewhat better performance per core but this is nothing like an unambiguous victory for Apple; it's basically a tie.

> I have an M1 Max, a few revisions old, and the only thing I can do to spin up the fans is run local LLMs or play Minecraft with the kids on a giant ultra wide monitor at full frame rate. Giant Rust builds and similar will barely turn on the fan. Normal stuff like browsing and using apps doesn’t even get it warm.

One of the reasons for this is that Apple has always been willing to run components right up to their temperature spec before turning on the fan. And then even though that's technically in spec, it's right on the line, which is bad for longevity.

In consumer devices it usually doesn't matter because most people rarely put any real load on their machines anyway, but it's something to be aware of if you actually intend to, e.g. there used to be a Mac Mini Server product and then people would put significant load on them and then they would eat the internal hard drives because the fan controller was tuned for acoustics over operating temperature.

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#194
post #82
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Much of the world (for better or worse) uses airconditioning in places they commonly use desktop computers.

no they don't. in some countries in europe (maybe in all of them?), installing airconditioning is frowned upon because it is considered a waste of energy. if you want government subsidies for replacing your heating system with a more energy efficient one you are not allowed to have airconditioning. and in the rest of the world only people/countries well of, that don't consider their energy usage, do it. airconditioni…

> installing airconditioning is frowned upon

Seattle was like this a couple of decades ago when I moved there. People sneered at me when I talked about having air conditioning installed at my house. Having moved from a warmer part of the country, I ignored their smug comments and did it anyway. The next few years I basked in the comfort of my climate-controlled home while my coworkers complained about not being able to sleep due to the heat.

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it does not. Which part of the text do you feel explains this?

First off, there's a chart for CPU temperature at the very top and they do talk about it: > I also double-checked if the CPU temperature of about 100 degrees celsius is too high, but no: [..] Intel specifies a maximum of 110 degrees. So, running at “only” 100 degrees for a few hours should be fine. Secondly, the article reads: > Tom’s Hardware recently reported that “Intel Raptor Lake crashes are increasing with risi…

Hmmh. On a new reading, you're right, the Tom's Hardware reference does justify it. Though I still wouldn't have discussed room temperature at all as it doesn't bring any useful extra information after already monitoring for the CPU temp.

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#198
post #65

I realize this has not much to do with CPU choice per se, but I'm still gonna leave this recommendation here for people who like to build PCs to get stuff done with :) Since I've been able to afford it and the market has had them available, I've been buying desktop systems with proper ECC support. I've been chasing flimsy but very annoying stability problems (some, of course, due to overclocking during my younger yea…

So I'm trying to learn more about this stuff, but aren't there multiple ECC flavors and the AMD consumer CPUs only support one of them (not the one you'd have on servers?)

Does anyone maintain a list with de-facto support of amd chips and mainboards? That partlist site only shows official support IIRC, so it won't give you any results.

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#199
post #78
post #65

I realize this has not much to do with CPU choice per se, but I'm still gonna leave this recommendation here for people who like to build PCs to get stuff done with :) Since I've been able to afford it and the market has had them available, I've been buying desktop systems with proper ECC support. I've been chasing flimsy but very annoying stability problems (some, of course, due to overclocking during my younger yea…

Isn't it mostly an ease of mind thing? I've never seen a ECC error on my home server which has plenty of memory in use and runs longer than my desktop. Maybe it's more common with higher clocked, near the limit, desktop PC's. Also: DDR5 has some false ecc marketing due to the memory standard having an error correction scheme build in. Don't fall for it.

I had a somewhat dodgy stick of used RAM (DDR4 UDIMM) in a Supermicro X11 board. This board is running my NAS, all ZFS, so RAM corruption can equal data corruption. The OS alerted me to recoverable errors on DIMM B2. Swapped it and another DIMM, rebooted, saw DIMM error on slot B1. Swapped it for a spare stick. No more errors.

This was running at like, 1866 or something. It's a pretty barebones 8th gen i3 with a beefier chipset, but ECC still came in clutch. I won't buy hardware for server purposes without it.

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#200
post #65

I realize this has not much to do with CPU choice per se, but I'm still gonna leave this recommendation here for people who like to build PCs to get stuff done with :) Since I've been able to afford it and the market has had them available, I've been buying desktop systems with proper ECC support. I've been chasing flimsy but very annoying stability problems (some, of course, due to overclocking during my younger yea…

Excellent point. It's a shame and a travesty that data integrity is still mostly locked away inside servers, leaving most other computing devices effectively toys, the early prototype demo thing but then never finished and sold forever at inflated prices. I wish AMD would make ECC a properly advertised feature with clear motherboard support. At least DDR5 has some level of ECC.

I wish AMD wouldn't gate APU ECC support behind unobtainium "PRO" SKUs they only give out, seemingly, to your typical "business" OEMs and the rare Chinese miniPC company.
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