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Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

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Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#191

Post by xupybd »

nkrisc wrote: post #25
juujian wrote: post #5

This is interesting news, for the lack of a better word. I've met more than one person with downs syndrome. They have definitely enriched my life and shown me a different way of looking at the world.

I think there’s a difference between appreciating those among us who have it for their perspective and differences and wishing it upon your child. I admit I was absolutely relieved when pre-natal screening was negative for it, both times. But if that was the hand we were dealt, then I’d take it. But that doesn’t mean I want it.

My friends baby tested positive for down syndrome in one of the early screenings. They suggested termination. When my friend asked what the chances were they said on that test they had a 1 in 100 chance of down syndrome.

That baby did not have down syndrome and is now a happy seven year old.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#192

Post by magicalhippo »

kbelder wrote: post #73
derektank wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It says that they've developed a way to identify the extra chromosome(s) passed to a child by a malfunctioning germ cell, specifically chromosome 21 though presumably this method could be reproduced for other trisomy diseases. This could, most immediately, lead to a therapy that allows a couple that is going through in vitro fertilization to repair a zygote that has trisomy by correcting the number of chromosomes it…

At that point, wouldn't they just use a different egg? I'd expect that to be far less costly and less risky than this treatment.

Harvesting eggs can be a huge strain both physically, emotionally and financially. And if you're older, and thus have elevated risk, you might get just a one or a few eggs per harvest.

Now factor in that the success rate of eggs turning into viable embryos that can be transferred back into the mother can be low. Even if you harvest say 10 eggs, a good catch, you may very well end up with just 1-2 viable embryos from those 10 eggs. And that's before considering trisomy as discussed here.

The final kicker is that harvesting takes time. You might well only be able to harvest a few times per year. And success rate drops quickly once you're past 38 or so.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#193

Post by trhway »

irrational wrote: post #88
phs318u wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...blonde, blue-eyed, round-eyed, strong-jawed, big-dicked, big boobed, you name it, you can have it!

Five out of six ain’t bad. Though, if my man boobs get a bit bigger…

As long as you can pay for it. Not everybody can drive Ferrari. (Or rephrasing a USSR movie quote - A society without an upper/lower differentiator has no purpose)

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#194

Post by trhway »

ghurtado wrote: post #99
puppycodes wrote: post #10

Interesting, I wonder what else this might lead too! Encouraging we might be getting somewhere. I used to live near a Down syndrome center where a bunch of folks lived and I remember this one lady who was kitted out with Britney Spears everything, lunchbox, t-shirt, hat, and headphones. Everyday I passed by the bus stop she would be dancing her heart out to a Britney track waiting for the bus and it made my world a l…

See, it's stories like this one that make me really question just how ethical it is to completely eliminate Down's from the gene pool. I understand it's the correct medical and scientific thing to do, it's just that it sometimes feels a little bit like eugenics for me.

Well, the test is simple - would you like to get Dawn chromosome yourself? Or may be have your children get it? I’m sure the answer is No.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#195

Post by Tade0 »

kulahan wrote: post #97
zarzavat wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some bioethics experts are concerned I do have to wonder what goes on in the minds of these people. My sister-in-law has a child with Down's syndrome and the situation basically ruined her life. She can no longer work, so they now struggle on a single income, if her husband were to leave her she would be completely screwed. To what end is that in the continuance of ethics?

Because it's a form of eugenics, however far down the spectrum it may be. edit: I mean to imply here that the overton window is shifted, basically.

The main evil of WW2 eugenics was preventing certain people from having children based on arbitrary rules.

Aborting a fetus with trisomia so that the couple can try again for a healthy child is nothing like that.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#196

Post by tstrimple »

hilsdev wrote: post #75
creakingstairs wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it just me or do I feel like the society is way more accepting nowadays? I had to pretty much hide who I was during school due to fear of bullying/ not fitting in but most kids these days seem to be able to be themselves in many ways. I agree we can be friendlier though!

You’re right the world is a lot more accepting. No matter how much things improve and how positive the trajectory though, there will be someone online who tells us it’s not enough

We live in a largely more accepting world that somehow exists in the same timeframe as "empathy is a sin". No matter how far we come as a society, there will always be people looking to "Make X Great Again" regardless of how great or not X ever was. Unfortunately humanity cannot rest on its laurels. No matter how much we advance as a civilization there will always be a conservative somewhere looking to pull up the ladder or cut off support. Ultimately looking for a way to game the system and deny benefits to others. It's quite amazing that we can look back on all the advances humanity has made in the last few centuries and can clearly see conservatives opposing all of it and somehow still rationalize conservatism as just some other process to achieve the same goals through other means. Yet at every major inflection point in our country conservatism has been the fucking enemy. They have been wrong. Every. Single. Time. When conservatives rebelled against the country and decided to start their own so they could maintain slavery, they were wrong. When conservatives fought against women's suffrage. They were wrong. When conservatives fought against civil rights. They were wrong. When conservatives fought against gay marriage. They were wrong. They have been wrong at literally every fucking important decision since their ideology was created during the French revolution. It's beyond time we stop pretending they have some insights worth listening to or some valuable lessons to convey and treat them as the enemies of humanity that they actually are.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#197

Post by jjj123 »

trhway wrote: post #194
ghurtado wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See, it's stories like this one that make me really question just how ethical it is to completely eliminate Down's from the gene pool. I understand it's the correct medical and scientific thing to do, it's just that it sometimes feels a little bit like eugenics for me.

Well, the test is simple - would you like to get Dawn chromosome yourself? Or may be have your children get it? I’m sure the answer is No.

That is not a simple test. Ask any straight person if they’d want to turn gay, the vast majority would say no. My guess is they’d say no if you asked the same question about their children.

But I’m gay, and while there are pros and cons to it, I wouldn’t trade it for anything in the world. And I don’t think just because someone else doesn’t want to be me is a reasonable bar for eradication.

To be clear, I’m not saying the two are equivalent, just pointing out that you need a better argument than “you don’t want this for yourself or your children, right?”.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#198

Post by WA »

foolfoolz wrote: post #80
puppycodes wrote: post #10

Interesting, I wonder what else this might lead too! Encouraging we might be getting somewhere. I used to live near a Down syndrome center where a bunch of folks lived and I remember this one lady who was kitted out with Britney Spears everything, lunchbox, t-shirt, hat, and headphones. Everyday I passed by the bus stop she would be dancing her heart out to a Britney track waiting for the bus and it made my world a l…

we are going to become very good at this. eliminating genetic errors, choosing to be straight, tall, etc

Homosexuality is not genetic.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#199

Post by dauertewigkeit »

lurk2 wrote: post #151
zarzavat wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some bioethics experts are concerned I do have to wonder what goes on in the minds of these people. My sister-in-law has a child with Down's syndrome and the situation basically ruined her life. She can no longer work, so they now struggle on a single income, if her husband were to leave her she would be completely screwed. To what end is that in the continuance of ethics?

You’re talking about a human person and making the case that the world would be better off if they had never been born.

Why is that bad? When the topic is abortion, not being born is considered a good thing for the child, whose life prospects aren't so good on account of the economic conditions of his mother.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#200

Post by robertlagrant »

tstrimple wrote: post #196
hilsdev wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re right the world is a lot more accepting. No matter how much things improve and how positive the trajectory though, there will be someone online who tells us it’s not enough

We live in a largely more accepting world that somehow exists in the same timeframe as "empathy is a sin". No matter how far we come as a society, there will always be people looking to "Make X Great Again" regardless of how great or not X ever was. Unfortunately humanity cannot rest on its laurels. No matter how much we advance as a civilization there will always be a conservative somewhere looking to pull up the la…

You've mis-defined "conservative" to mean "everyone who lost in history".
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