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One-Click RCE in Asus's Preinstalled Driver Software

mrbruh.com

191–200 of 253 posts

Re: One-Click RCE in Asus's Preinstalled Driver Software

#191
post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems like a fallacious analogy to me. Why is a cracked bridge dangerous? Because anyone traveling over it or under it is at risk of being hurt if the bridge collapses. Warning people that it is cracking does not increase the likelihood of a collapse. Why is a software vulnerability dangerous? Because anyone who knows about it and has nefarious intent can now use it as a weapon against those who are using the vu…

A cracked bridge is always dangerous. A vulnerable piece of software is always dangerous. There are large numbers of state funded exploit groups and otherwise blackhat organizations that find and store these vulnerabilities waiting for the right opportunity, say economic warfare. Much like building safe bridges from the start we need the same ideology in software. The 'we can always patch it later' is eventually goin…

I agree with the conclusion that we need safer software from the start.

But we also have to deal with the reality of the situation in front of us.

I will maintain that the differences between the implications of revealing a crack in a bridge vs. prematurely revealing a vulnerability to literally the entire world are stark. I find it pretty problematic to continue comparing them and a rather poor analogy.

> There are large numbers of state funded exploit groups and otherwise blackhat organizations that find and store these vulnerabilities

This underscores my point. What you’ve been describing is a scenario in which those organizations are handed new ammunition for free (assuming they don’t already have the vuln in their catalog).

Re: One-Click RCE in Asus's Preinstalled Driver Software

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. People keep pushing this false dichotomy that it's either company-directed 'responsible disclosure', or it's "release full working POC and complete writeup publicly, immediately", and there's no middle ground. Yes, limited disclosure will make people start hunting for the vuln, but it's still more than enough time for me to revoke an API key, lock down an internet-facing service, turn off my Alexa (no, I don't/w…

Knowing a half-truth is as bad as knowing nothing. Half the time I will do useless mitigations because actually I would have been unaffected. The other half I will do the wrong thing because of incomplete reporting.

This is true of even disclosures with all information available.

I can't count how many people did incorrect or unnecessary fixes for log4shell, even months after it was disclosed.

Re: One-Click RCE in Asus's Preinstalled Driver Software

#193
post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is your position on open source projects? Should someone who writes software in their spare time who decides to share it publicly be forced to stop doing so? I’m more open to harsher limits on commercial software, especially in certain categories. But underneath all of this we’re discussing an ecosystem and a culture which can’t be cleanly separated. Some of the binary thinking I see in this thread would be deep…

I don't have the answer here. Open source is the base of a lot of secure software. And at the same time open source software gets pulled into other functional software that has wide spread and potentially dangerous outcomes. OpenSSL for example. Any security flaw in this package has worldwide effects, but we would be lessor without it. Another example is the xz software that was attacked and then pulled into distribu…

Therein lies the rub. Whatever the answer is, it will require careful and thoughtful solutions, not oversimplified conclusions that raking developers over the coals publicly with no warning is somehow “Good”.

To be clear, I have far less sympathy for big software shops that pump out negligently bad code and then have to be prodded to fix it, but they’re not the only players involved.

Re: One-Click RCE in Asus's Preinstalled Driver Software

#194
post #44
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This makes me angry, so can anyone think of a legitimate steelman of their position? Expect my view is consistent with reality, though: they’re chasing profits and getting away with it, so why go on the record and look bad if they can ignore & spend that time on marketing.

ASUS doesn’t want to deal with the social media horde, who can and will cherry pick words and take things out of context. If a person comes to talk business with a camera attached to his head, I know he does not come in good faith.

It's a journalist coming, because you said you want to talk to the journalist, because of the bad press you had before, because you fucked up.

Seems fair to take a camera.

Re: One-Click RCE in Asus's Preinstalled Driver Software

#195

Responsible Disclosures and their consequences have been a disaster for the human race. Companies need to feel a lot more pain a lot more often in order for them to take the security of their customers a lot more serious. If you just give them month to fix an issue and spoon-feed them the solution it's just another ticket in their Backlog. But if every other security issue becomes enough news online that their CEOs a…

I think ASUS' turnaround time on this was quite good, I don't see the problem here. ASUS didn't deny the bug, didn't threaten to prosecute anyone for reverse engineering their software, and quickly patched their software. I have no doubt that before the days of responsible disclosure, this process would've taken months and might have involved the police. Normal people don't care about vulnerabilities. They use phones…

>They say “This issue is limited to motherboards and does not affect laptops, desktop computers”, however this affects any computer including desktops/laptops that have DriverHub installed

>instead of them saying it allows for arbitrary/remote code execution they say it “may allow untrusted sources to affect system behaviour”.

Sounds like Asus did in fact deny the bug.

Re: One-Click RCE in Asus's Preinstalled Driver Software

#196
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HackerOne, BugCrowd, et al don't appear to make any serious effort to vet reports themselves.

Is that true? I thought you could pay for a H1 service that basically had professionals triaging the vulnerabilities and only pass on the correct ones?

Our company pays for one of these third party triage services for H1.

The quality is seriously lacking. They have dismissed many valid findings.

Re: One-Click RCE in Asus's Preinstalled Driver Software

#197
> When submitting the vulnerability report through ASUS’s Security Advisory form, Amazon CloudFront flagged the attached PoC as a malicious request and blocked the submission.

Reminds me of the time I reported SQL disclosure vuln to Vivaldi and their WAF banned my account for - wait for it - 'SQL injection attempt' so hard their admin was unable to unlock it :)

Re: One-Click RCE in Asus's Preinstalled Driver Software

#198
post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Licensed professional engineers" are a software-development myth. If all our software was as simple as a bridge, then we could have that. A bridge is 5 sheets of plans, 10 pages of founding checks, 30 pages of calculations, 100 pages of material specs. You can read all those in a day. Check the calculations in a week. Next bridge will be almost the same. Now tell me about any software where the spec is that short an…

I hate to be dismissive, but tired old meme is tired. With what I do I work with a lot of larger companies and get to see the crap they push out with no architectural design and no initial security posture. I see apps with thousands of packages, including things like typosquats. I see the quality of the security teams which are contractors following checklists with no idea what they mean. Saying that actual professio…

No. Licensed professionals are the engineering checklist people. "Not my fault, wasn't on the checklist, I've used the official approved one".

Licensed professionals checked a dam built by licensed professionals. Dam broke, killed people. Everyone claims to be innocent and the other party didn't read the right reports or didn't report the right problems: https://www.ecchr.eu/fileadmin/Fallbeschreibungen/Case_Repor... It is all just another method of shifting blame.

What really helps more than prescriptive regulation is liability. As soon as there is a strict liability for software companies, things will get better. What could also help is mandatory insurance for software producers. Then the insurance companies will either charge them big bucks or demand proof of safety and security.

Re: One-Click RCE in Asus's Preinstalled Driver Software

#199
post #65
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the vulnerability can't be fixed within the week, maybe the company should be SOL. This will incentivize companies to build their software better, as they'll know that any vulnerability that is hard to fix will mean consequences. Maybe the mitigation is for the company to take its service down while it works on the problem. Again, a good incentive to avoid that in the first place. Also an incentive to not waste an…

I hear what you're saying and I agree, but it's perhaps too black and white. Let's take one of the most disastrous bugs in recent history: meltdown. Speculative execution attacks inside the CPU. This required (in Paul Turners words): putting a warehouse of trampolines around an overly energetic 7-year old. This, understandably took a lot of time, both for microcode and OS vendors.. it took even longer to fix it in si…

Spectre/Meltdown is the perfect example of a vendor, Intel and AMD, deflecting blame onto the OS and software producers, successfully avoiding a recall, avoiding refunds for decreased performance and avoiding most of the blame.

What actually should have happened there is a full recall of all affected hardware. Microcode fixes and payments for lost performance in the mean time, until the new hardware arrives.

Meltdown was a desaster, but not only because the bugs themselves were bad. But also especially because we let Intel and AMD get away scott free.

Re: One-Click RCE in Asus's Preinstalled Driver Software

#200

Responsible Disclosures and their consequences have been a disaster for the human race. Companies need to feel a lot more pain a lot more often in order for them to take the security of their customers a lot more serious. If you just give them month to fix an issue and spoon-feed them the solution it's just another ticket in their Backlog. But if every other security issue becomes enough news online that their CEOs a…

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