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The Brief Origins of May Day

archive.iww.org

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Re: The Brief Origins of May Day

#191

Post by ferguess_k »

parpfish wrote: post #16

Why don’t labor issues resonate more with tech workers? I know that we’re not a monolith and are actually a heterogeneous mix of opinions, but there frequently talk about job dissatisfaction (career burnout, comically stingy equity grants, etc). But when organizing comes up, it’s usually treated with disdain because so many have bought into highly individualistic hustle-culture and the narrative that unions only exis…

Tech workers, or white collars in general, believe in the law (I'm Not A Lawyer, as well as looking as the union as a solution) and sort of peaceful solution, without much violence.

Re: The Brief Origins of May Day

#192

Post by p_j_w »

constantcrying wrote: post #146
bsnnkv wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You keep repeating this in various comments throughout this submission- can you share links to the materials of the union(s) you are referring to and point out the relevant sections where they are advocating for this? I am curious to take a read for myself, as I'm sure many other readers are

It's the IGM and of course it isn't their public position, but it is clear that this is what they think and how they behave. They also are extremely influential in my company, as part of the Betriebsrat, and try to steer it in that direction. I recently had to deal with them (as part of the Betriebsrat) and, just as human beings, they seemed to be some of the worst people I ever met.

[flagged]

Re: The Brief Origins of May Day

#193

Post by 9rx »

0xbadcafebee wrote: post #151
parpfish wrote: post #16

Why don’t labor issues resonate more with tech workers? I know that we’re not a monolith and are actually a heterogeneous mix of opinions, but there frequently talk about job dissatisfaction (career burnout, comically stingy equity grants, etc). But when organizing comes up, it’s usually treated with disdain because so many have bought into highly individualistic hustle-culture and the narrative that unions only exis…

We make a lot of money. Money pays for healthcare, childcare, paternity/maternity leave, retirement, food, housing, transportation, in addition to recreation. Our "struggle" is invented. Oh, career burnout huh? So you're working yourself harder than you have to in order to make more money? Sounds tough. And small equity grants? Oh gosh, how dare they not give us even more money . People who don't make a lot of money…

> We make a lot of money.

Not compared to many unionized industries. Workers in professional sports and entertainment, for example, which fully embrace labor unions, make software developers look like they work for peanuts.

> Unions exist because workers were literally being killed by their employers.

Labor unions have formed when death was actually on the horizon because death was on the horizon, but labor unions today are almost exclusively a rich man's sport. The poor aren't poor enough to face certain death, but aren't rich enough to risk the consequences of not working (i.e. striking) for beneficial-but-not-life-threatning demands, so it is not a reasonable choice for them to make. Hence why you almost never find labor unions in low paying jobs.

Tech doesn't like unions simply because, as a group, tech doesn't like people. That's what a union is, after all: A group of people who have decided to associate with each other.

Re: The Brief Origins of May Day

#194

Post by dttze »

seneca wrote: post #165
cruzcampo wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

[flagged]

Starvation has historically been used as one of the most effective ways to commit violence on populations and is often used by militaries.

If you do not think that is violence, I'd love to hear what qualifies in your mind.

Re: The Brief Origins of May Day

#195

Post by int_19h »

vuggamie wrote: post #65
dauertewigkeit wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes solidarity between workers possible is the homogeneity of their labour. This condition is not present for tech workers. Labour market conditions are completely different from those of say, a meat processing plant or a factory assembly line.

There is more than enough homogeneity of labor in this industry. All workers should organize.

Seeing how the article link is to IWW, it might be interesting to bring up their take: not only all workers should organize, but they should organize in a single union cutting across industries to maximize their collective power vs holders of capital. IWW strives to become exactly that.

Re: The Brief Origins of May Day

#196

Post by reillyse »

bee_rider wrote: post #175
dragonwriter wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why don’t labor issues resonate more with tech workers? Because many tech workers don't see themselves as workers, with some justification, many having substantial capital investments alongside labor income, making them, in class terms, petit bourgeois or at least close enough to it to perceive their own interests in more bourgeois than proletarian terms. And even the tech workers that are clearly part of the prole…

I’ve always thought of it in these terms: Working class: you are sustained by your current labor. Upper class: you can sustain yourself based on the returns from your investments more-or-less indefinitely. Middle class, between the two: you can sustain yourself off your investments for so long that you can’t practically be threatened by unemployment. It is a labor relations issue explicitly, you need a union if you a…

I honestly think the "middle class" idea is just a fallacy. It feels like it's used by people to distance themselves from "working class" because they feel that working class is somehow beneath them. All of the middle class in todays parlance are just slightly more affluent working class. If you sell your time for money you are working class. If you make money from having money you are bourgeoisie.

If you have to think about which one you are you are working class. At a stretch you might consider the owner of a small tech company (say 5-10 employees) as petit bourgeoisie but the vast majority of small business owners (say mechanics, shop owners, small companies) are squarely in the working class. They may have employees but they still work, either for wages or as managers of those employees - which is work.

Re: The Brief Origins of May Day

#198

Post by stuaxo »

It's been a long time, and the 8 hour day was a good advance back then.

Now, we need a 4 day week (1 day less work) at the same pay, just as back then they moved from 10-16 hour working days to 8, for the same pay at the end of the week.

Re: The Brief Origins of May Day

#199

Post by int_19h »

soupfordummies wrote: post #6

Badass read. Geez we are soft today…

Seeing how the atticle link is to the website of the IWW (International Workers of the World, a very oldschool union dating back to the early days of labor movement), why not take the first step today and join it?

https://www.iww.org/membership/

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