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Wall Street stocks tumble as investors fret over US economic slowdown

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Re: Wall Street stocks tumble as investors fret over US economic slowdown

#191

Post by spacemadness »

eli_gottlieb wrote: post #98
boo-ga-ga wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But he continues doing what he started. Considering the fact that he is very smart and definitely hungry for absolute power, you can think about his true goal. If he is ready to risk that much of his worth, it means that the potential win for him will bring so much more.

Or he's misestimating his potential wins because he's on tons of drugs and they're giving him delusions of grandeur.

This seems like the closest thing to an Occam’s razor take to me. If all his companies crash and burn from his unhinged behavior, he’s not going to be useful to other billionaires or as powerful regardless. The fact so much of his wealth is in Tesla, a company that relies on climate conscious consumers, and he throws around nazi salutes in a heavily watched and historical event makes no sense at all. Meanwhile the administration is dismantling anything that would help EVs. It’s not 5D chess, sorry. I wonder what Tesla engineers and others inside the company think about all this.

Re: Wall Street stocks tumble as investors fret over US economic slowdown

#192

Post by rayiner »

Aunche wrote: post #166
andrewla wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there a specific aspect of the administration's policies which you believe are causing this? Candidates would include "actual impact of tariffs enacted" or "uncertainty about future tariffs" or the same things but with "geopolitical decisions" instead of tariffs. Or similarly "fiscal solvency" or "profile of government spending" etc. It's all well and good to make untestable post facto explanations based on vibes…

Tariff may be worse for the economy, but threatening tariffs as a "negotiating tactic" with Canada and Mexico is just plain stupid. Unless if they have insider information, businesses simply have no idea how to operate. For example, it would take years to build a factory, and they don't want to sink hundreds of millions in a factory in the US if tariffs don't actually go through or vice versa.

That makes building the factory in the U.S. the safe choice whether tariffs are implemented or not.

Re: Wall Street stocks tumble as investors fret over US economic slowdown

#193

Post by [deleted] »

H1Supreme wrote: post #185
voidhorse wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The only thing more absurd is the fact that some people didn't see this coming. He signalled everything that he's doing now during his campaign, over and over. Right, I think it's less that they "didn't see it coming" and more so a basic lack of understanding around how anything works and a complete trust in perceived wealth and authority. The vast majority of people I know that fell into the camp of voting this in…

I'm in an area of the country in which he won easily in the polls. Whenever I hear the "run the country like a business" line, I always ask "What's the product? And who is the customer?". I haven't received an actual answer yet.

[deleted]

Re: Wall Street stocks tumble as investors fret over US economic slowdown

#194

Post by Aunche »

rayiner wrote: post #192
Aunche wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tariff may be worse for the economy, but threatening tariffs as a "negotiating tactic" with Canada and Mexico is just plain stupid. Unless if they have insider information, businesses simply have no idea how to operate. For example, it would take years to build a factory, and they don't want to sink hundreds of millions in a factory in the US if tariffs don't actually go through or vice versa.

That makes building the factory in the U.S. the safe choice whether tariffs are implemented or not.

How is it safe to spend all this money on a domestic factory just for it to be cheaper to import everything anyways? The safe choice is to hoard cash and inventory until they have certainty of whether tariffs will happen or not. All Trump is doing is creating unnecessary deadweight loss when he can just negotiate without threatening a suicide pact.

Re: Wall Street stocks tumble as investors fret over US economic slowdown

#195

Post by csa »

vkou wrote: post #82
idle_zealot wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This analysis is lacking. People didn't vote for Trump because they analyzed his proposed economic policies and decided they would improve their situation. Almost nobody votes like that. There's general financial anxiety in the US, and he promised to fix it. What methods he proposed using are almost irrelevant, it's the rhetoric around them that sways voters. The narrative is now one of temporary hardship to excise t…

Harris also promised to fix it, and had an actual plan for addressing housing, education, medical costs, and prices in general, but we are all now pretending like none of that was a part of her campaign. Anyways, it's telling that everyone who was anxious over $3.50/dozen eggs in November is deathly silent over what's been happening in the past few weeks. All of a sudden, all of those people are now in the 'we have t…

> Harris also promised to fix it, and had an actual plan for addressing housing, education, medical costs, and prices in general, but we are all now pretending like none of that was a part of her campaign.

Part of that is because there were tons of ads focusing on taxpayer funded sex changes for prisoners (funded by pro-Trump orgs):

https://youtu.be/kQEMn1yRYVU

I have friends and family in Georgia, supposedly a swing state. They said that they could not escape seeing this add multiple times a day on tv or internet.

Regardless of what one believes about the underlying premise of the ad, it is incredibly narrow in terms of scope, and that narrative stuck.

I have a feeling this is one reason why many folks weren’t aware of her plans.

Re: Wall Street stocks tumble as investors fret over US economic slowdown

#196

Post by insane_dreamer »

rufus_foreman wrote: post #75
JKCalhoun wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With talk of a anticipated 10% to 20% drop in the markets, their silence could be ruinous.

The stock market falls by 10% or more on average every 1.2 years: https://www.covenantwealthadvisors.com/post/understanding-st... . There were 5 such drops in 2020, 4 in 2022, and 1 in 2023. Somehow, the nation avoided ruin during those periods.

> Somehow, the nation avoided ruin during those periods.

2020 was a serious recession; the nation may have avoided ruin, but many people did not

Re: Wall Street stocks tumble as investors fret over US economic slowdown

#197

Post by insane_dreamer »

mattmaroon wrote: post #50
JKCalhoun wrote: post #8

It'll be wild to see how Congress responds.

It's commonly said Presidents get 100 days in office to enact the bulk of their platform. It's an approximation, of course, but it's about then that the new-to-office approval rating bump starts to wane and Congress starts gearing up for midterms. We're about half way there. If the economy is in bad shape in May, I would not be surprised if Congress intervenes on tariffs. The fear of being primaried by MAGA loyalists…

> Congress intervenes on tariffs

the tariffs on Canada/Mexico haven't gone into effect yet and Trump may yet again change his mind or end up keeping it restricted to a few select industries (i.e. steel) who are clamoring for it (my guess is the latter)

As for China, I think many in Congress from both parties are supportive of them, so I would expect those to stay

Re: Wall Street stocks tumble as investors fret over US economic slowdown

#198

Post by insane_dreamer »

fatbird wrote: post #66

Peter Navarro is the big driver of Trump's economic approach (and he's a mercantilist quack): https://hatchetmedia.substack.com/p/the-man-behind-trumps-wa... (podcast with Justin Ling, a great independent journalist) and https://www.bugeyedandshameless.com/p/beggar-thy-neighbor-be...

also a long-time China hawk (like on the far end of hawkism)

Re: Wall Street stocks tumble as investors fret over US economic slowdown

#199

Post by insane_dreamer »

skippyboxedhero wrote: post #151
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why do they need to? Messaging and frankly national security.

So the EU needs to hit back for "national security" reasons against the country which has subsidised their security to the tune of tens of trillions. ...yep, makes perfect sense.

fight fire with fire

Re: Wall Street stocks tumble as investors fret over US economic slowdown

#200

Post by insane_dreamer »

boo-ga-ga wrote: post #59
BenFranklin100 wrote: post #22

Tesla stock has been particularly hammered. Ontario apparently cancelled a Starlink contract and Italy is considering to do so as well. Musk’s political antics are affecting his businesses.

But he continues doing what he started. Considering the fact that he is very smart and definitely hungry for absolute power, you can think about his true goal. If he is ready to risk that much of his worth, it means that the potential win for him will bring so much more.

> that the potential win for him will bring so much more.

what do you think is the potential win for him?

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