Earlier quoted context omitted.
There was a good (?) video on the subject the other day, it was mainly about Volkswagen / VAG but highlighted the software problem. Cars are / were basically Frankenstein monsters under the hood, with dozens of onboard computers / chips all needing to work independently yet collaboratively and talk to each other. VW set up a new subsidiary and hired 3000 people to build the car software system of the future, reducing…
I'm afraid a lot of the tech is either necessary by law or necessary to get a decent safety rating these days, so you can't make the simple cars from yesteryear. Now, screens aren't required by law or safety ratings, but there's no getting around having a lot of software in there, and thus a screen to configure all that stuff.
To buy a Tesla Model 3, only to end up in hell
191–200 of 593 posts
Re: To buy a Tesla Model 3, only to end up in hell
#192Earlier quoted context omitted.
The BMW G20 3-series before and after the facelift[1] perfectly exemplifies this issue. [1]: https://cdn.bmwblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/05/bmw-3-ser... EDIT: top is after, bottom is before.
I'd take the bottom picture any day. Is that the newer or older one? Although the LED strips are stupid. The top pic I saw in the showroom and I really didn't like it.
Re: To buy a Tesla Model 3, only to end up in hell
#193Earlier quoted context omitted.
>>(XC40 T8 EV). Such model doesn't exist. Do you mean XC60? And if so then it's not an EV, it's a PHEV. Anyway, Volvo made a collosal mistake of going with the Android Automotive operating system. It looks good but it's genuienly a pile of steaming crap. When Volvo had Sensus(their own OS) yeah it wasn't pretty but it was stable and it worked day in day out. I have a 2020 XC60 T8 with sensus and I literally have had…
I disagree with that. I really like the Android infotainment system because 1) voice control actually works and 2) built in Google maps is all I want in a car and they work very well. As far as I can tell the issues they have had is with their poor software engineering team and picking extremely mediocre hardware that is too slow to run it.
English is not my native language so I'm yet to find a car where this works. But it's not a problem with the car, it's Google's voice assistant being useless for anything other than English sounding names. I can say "Google call Janusz Zawadiadzki" and there's exactly 0% chance it will work. It just can't do it. Don't get me started on it trying to read texts that aren't written in English when the system language is set to English, it's hilarious.
>> picking extremely mediocre hardware that is too slow to run it.
It freezing and losing sound and generally being in all kinds of non-operational state isn't due to the hardware being slow, it just doesn't pass muster for automotive-grade software which should never exhibit any of these behaviours no matter what.
Re: To buy a Tesla Model 3, only to end up in hell
#194I stoped reading when the writer admitted, that he bought a Tesla in a country without official dealership. Common sense tells me not to do this. That’s the situation when EU consumer laws start failing. That’s very brave, but not clever move at all!!! Having service center 300 miles away is too far. It’s not lot of statistics, but I know cases where guys needed replacement parts before new other brand car reached 50…
> That’s the situation when EU consumer laws start failing That is not true at all. You have EXACTLY the same protections no matter where you purchase from in the EU, and there is a lot of assistance set up specifically to help handling cross-border issues. I do agree that the distance is definitely an issue for service though - its exactly why I haven't purchased a tesla
Edit: had this situation in 2024. BMW sold a faulty car with international warranty. When the buyer found broken rear differential BMW offered to cover 3% repair cost. So the question was to sue BMW or pay 4000€ for by warranty covered repair out of own pocket.
Re: To buy a Tesla Model 3, only to end up in hell
#195We need the EV revolution to save the climate but we were also promised that EVs would have less defects and be more maintainable than traditional ICE cars. But it turns out Teslas and Chinese EVs are among the worst performing in the mandatory periodic inspections in many European countries. This is not because of some anti-US/China bias in European car inspections because Ford (US) and Volvo (China) are doing well.…
>Ford (US) and Volvo (China) Isn't Volvo Swedish?
The situation is not dissimilar to Rolls-Royce plc (publicly-owned, mostly British; makes jet engines and other high-performance turbines) versus Rolls-Royce Motor Cars (owned entirely by BMW; makes cars only, and use BMW engines).
Re: To buy a Tesla Model 3, only to end up in hell
#196The safest bet in EVs is to buy one from the Korean manufacturers - they have the tech figured out (and have had it for a few years), they make everything from 'car but electric' to 'Jetsons spaceship', they're reasonably priced, they have cheap and abundant parts, have mechanics who know how to work on them, and they don't have an 'X' factor CEO.
> The safest bet in EVs is to buy one from the Korean manufacturers - they have the tech figured out (and have had it for a few years) Not an EV, but I have a 2022 Kia Sorento with a fair number of weird software bugs-e.g. the sound from the navigation system randomly stops working and I have to restart the car to make it work again; the car tries to read speed limit signs using machine vision but its capabilities ar…
Re: To buy a Tesla Model 3, only to end up in hell
#197I'm sorry to have to say this, but buying a Tesla in 2024 is a terrible choice - the car is horrible to drive, not to mention customer satisfaction, reliability and ethical concerns. Hyundai and Polestar are way better electric options that are actually enjoyable and comfortable to drive
No, it is objectively not "horrible" to drive, the Model Y was the world's best selling car two years in a row for a reason. But OP has clearly received a lemon, and Tesla service has a well-deserved reputation for being extremely slow when they need to fix any non-trivial issue. And in the OP's case buying the car in a country with no official Tesla presence is making things even worse.
I have no idea how it drives, and I am pretty sure the answer is not "horrible", but the sale numbers of a car that is ordered mostly online without test drives doesn't mean anything.
Re: To buy a Tesla Model 3, only to end up in hell
#198First, they will tell you how to complain to the company - what specific terms to use, and how long they have to respond and to resolve your matter.
Second, if you don't get a proper resolution, they will advise you how to sue the seller. You will usually have law on your side by that point, so there is almost no way the seller can weasel out.
Third, the consumer rights office you talk to might have contacts for expert investigators who can act as a third party in your court case. They will provide a written statement to the effect of "this is what happened, this is the law, the buyer can demand this remedy".
Finally, the seller will likely settle out of court, because you're not the first customer they abused and they already know how these things go. In the EU, you will often get either a replacement of the item, or a full refund, or sometimes you might get to choose. That is the bare minimum, you can also demand that they pay your court costs in most EU countries, and some compensation for loss of income, cancelled holidays, and other such things. Depending on how strong your negotiating position is, you will get some of these things.
If you have a website about how bad the product is and you are willing to take it down or write about reaching a satisfactory conclusion after negotiations with the seller, your negotiating position is very strong.
The consumer rights office will tell you all this process and it will vary a little bit. But it's important to do this relatively without delay, there is no point in dealing with unresponsive customer service. You need to tell them the right things by law and they will be forced to respond or to face the lawsuit. An abusive company will not respond out of good will, without compelling them to, you are just wasting time.
In Holland, the consumer rights office is the ACM.
Re: To buy a Tesla Model 3, only to end up in hell
#199I had similar experiences with a modern Volvo. (XC40 T8 EV). Modern cars seem to be absolutely terrible. It's like all those Single Page Applications on the web that are just downgrades over the classic Server-Side Rendered apps. Sure, you have more features, but at what cost? Reliability. I think the last generations of cars before the touch buttons and screens were the last "okay" generation. Somewhere in 2010s, al…
All software is like its makers full of attention-whoring. Its a nasty side-effect of the "identify with your work" ethics. Thus i propose a new job, the ux-castrator. His only job, is to traverse the software and excise out tumorous attention hogging growths and limitations based upon thee. Back to the chasm from which you came daemon, for the user needs not see you, know you, be aware of you and your works. You are…
Management by metrics makes this worse, by forcing staff to game the metrics.