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Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe'

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Re: Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe'

#191

Post by learc83 »

drivebyacct2 wrote: post #151
learc83 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Nothing is forcing you to use Metro. In fact, only apps that have an UI designed specifically for Metro will use the Metro environment. What happens when the majority of apps you want to use are Metro apps?

That's not the case. Like, it's not like they're removing desktop apps and reinstating them as Metro apps. If you decide to exclusively use Metro apps, then I guess that's your problem. Otherwise, I don't really understand what point you're trying to make. I seriously, seriously question in half of the people attempting to spread shit about Windows 8 here have ever seriously used it for more than 3 minutes in a VM.

Only Metro apps work on Windows RT. Developers want the largest audience possible, so it makes sense that most of them will eventually want to target Windows RT, which is clearly what Microsoft is going for.

It's going to get harder and harder to avoid metro apps.

Re: Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe'

#192

Post by recoiledsnake »

Fargren wrote: post #183
MattSayar wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe this approach raises the overall quality of games in the Marketplace. A developer on Xbox Live Marketplace will be less inclined to rush out a broken game and release updates every day until it works. If they have to pay $40k/update, they have an incentive to do it right the first time, with some leeway to fix unforeseen bugs (the free first update).

That's not very good for small developers that may want to iterate over their games or provide extra content for their users. Developers who simply do not have the resources to test in a wide variety for hardware, or to get their game just perfect for the first update. And as a user, I love having access to games by these developers. Steam would lose a lot of value to me if it wasn't such a helpful platform for small…

>Developers who simply do not have the resources to test in a wide variety for hardware, or to get their game just perfect for the first update

We're talking about the XBox. There's only one hardware device to test against.

Also, the first update is free.

Re: Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe'

#193

Post by dyselon »

Fargren wrote: post #183
MattSayar wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe this approach raises the overall quality of games in the Marketplace. A developer on Xbox Live Marketplace will be less inclined to rush out a broken game and release updates every day until it works. If they have to pay $40k/update, they have an incentive to do it right the first time, with some leeway to fix unforeseen bugs (the free first update).

That's not very good for small developers that may want to iterate over their games or provide extra content for their users. Developers who simply do not have the resources to test in a wide variety for hardware, or to get their game just perfect for the first update. And as a user, I love having access to games by these developers. Steam would lose a lot of value to me if it wasn't such a helpful platform for small…

MS has pretty strict size restrictions on title updates, since they have to fit in cache for users with no real hard drives. This means you're not going to deliver new content through patches anyway - you have to distribute it through DLC instead. This leads to about a million other problems, primarily when it comes to compatibility between players online who may or may not have the DLC, duplicating content since you're required to not have dependencies between your DLC, and the fact that MS frowns on free DLC.

Re: Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe'

#194

Post by commandar »

lerouxb wrote: post #156
commandar wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm also of the opinion that the problems I've seen are too deep to realistically be fixed in the few months left before W8 goes RTM.

Why do they have to be fixed before then?

Because they're fundamental UI issues that Microsoft generally won't touch after a general release.

Re: Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe'

#195

Post by farinasa »

viraptor wrote: post #89
farinasa wrote: post #26

Many people say that they have this or that application that keeps them clinging to windows and for me it has always been games. If it weren't for games, I would never use windows on any of my personal machines again, let alone purchase it. Linux distros don't even sell their products yet somehow are better thought out than any version of windows.

But they do sell the software. Either directly as a managed solutions to big companies, or very indirectly implement something per request or to solve an internal need. Or even offering support or getting some features sponsored. You may not give them money, but there are people / companies that do.

It makes sense for corporations to pay for support if it costs less than hiring a team of people to do it. If that is the strategy a company uses to make their products more accessible to me, I'm all for it.

Re: Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe'

#196

Post by Fargren »

recoiledsnake wrote: post #192
Fargren wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not very good for small developers that may want to iterate over their games or provide extra content for their users. Developers who simply do not have the resources to test in a wide variety for hardware, or to get their game just perfect for the first update. And as a user, I love having access to games by these developers. Steam would lose a lot of value to me if it wasn't such a helpful platform for small…

>Developers who simply do not have the resources to test in a wide variety for hardware, or to get their game just perfect for the first update We're talking about the XBox. There's only one hardware device to test against. Also, the first update is free.

I was arguing that this policy would be bad for Steam or other PC marketplace services. It's possible than on a closed system such as the XBox some of the disadvantages of this are alleviated or solved. I still think charging the dev for adding extra content for his game is a very bad idea, though. Team Fortress 2 for the XBox sucks for it, for example. Regular updates is a good model for the user, and it hurts the user to charge for content that would otherwise be free. Alas, I know that helps greatly reduce the number of bugs in the system.

Re: Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe'

#197

Post by CamperBob2 »

archangel_one wrote: post #169
CamperBob2 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For rarely launched apps, hit the Win key and start typing the name There should be an app for that. It could be called... oh, I don't know, how about COMMAND.COM?

Not many application executables in Windows are in your PATH, so cmd is not going to find them. Even for the ones that are, you have to type the name of the .exe which is not necessarily obvious; eg. Visual Studio -> devenv.exe.

It was a joke, son

Re: Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe'

#198

Post by msh »

james4k wrote: post #164
msh wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The windows app store gives unlimited free updates. It's only xbla for Xbox where they charge for updates.

Do you know if there is an approval process?

No, but based on the windows phone store I guess that there will be.

Re: Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe'

#199

Post by lerouxb »

commandar wrote: post #194
lerouxb wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do they have to be fixed before then?

Because they're fundamental UI issues that Microsoft generally won't touch after a general release.

I thought we were talking about Steam which is made by Valve.
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