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"Hetzner decided to cancel our account and terminate all servers"

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Re: "Hetzner decided to cancel our account and terminate all servers"

#191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you try to send them 20€ and request refund of excessive amount?

A customer shouldn't be the one going through such hops in order to "satisfy" a provider who can't bother to accept a widely used mean of payment

Sure. In theory. In real world being a customer often means adapting your expectations and finding workarounds to get what you need. If this solution could have worked, building your own data center would seem rather extreme and unpractical.

Re: "Hetzner decided to cancel our account and terminate all servers"

#193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Foreigners are typically getting screwed in Germany precisely because they don't know their rights or where to go to ask for (free) legal advice. If your landlord puts something in the contract that is against the law you can sign it and simply ignore it.

>Foreigners are typically getting screwed in Germany precisely because they don't know their rights or where to go to ask for (free) legal advice. Or simply because the alternative is being homeless? And why should the default for foreigners be getting screwed?

> Or simply because the alternative is being homeless?

As I already mentioned, you can simply sign a contract and then proceed to ignore all the illegal clauses. They're not binding.

> And why should the default for foreigners be getting screwed?

People getting screwed because of them not knowing their rights is basically something that can happen in every legal system, and if people come from other countries without certain legal protections, they're more likely to not know about them. That's just a reality of life.

Re: "Hetzner decided to cancel our account and terminate all servers"

#194

Whenever I ask a CTO if they have a backup (or plan-B) they say we're on AWS, we backup there and they will never go down as a company. And then I ask them what they do when their account gets shut (e.g. because they are selling something bad on Amazon and have the same phone number as the company account?) Or the instance some years ago where GCP closed because someone had wrongly classified image on their drive? Yo…

Of course, never put all your eggs in the same basket. Have a different registrar as well, and maybe a different CDN ready to go at a moment's notice.

Re: "Hetzner decided to cancel our account and terminate all servers"

#195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They've gone the route of multiple AWS accounts in my company to avoid the issue they introduced with horrible planning. First they wanted us out of on-premise, and told us costs wouldn't matter. Then they wanted us to be 'cloud agnostic', but when given deadlines changed to 'get it working in AWS ASAP, doesn't matter the tech debt' Now they're freaking out about AWS costs, and we're back to juggling 'cloud agnostic'…

I’d ask, “have we worked together?” since this is a spot on description of my former employer, except it’s probably a spot on description of thousands of mid sized companies.

Same! Some execs get excited about reducing capital expenses for a data center and the teams that manage it. Some CTO gets excited about the flexibility and some legitimate benefits of cloud.

But it ends up costing a shitton of money to switch paradigms completely, and they don't switch paradigms completely for a number of years: If you're just migrating servers to ec2/vpc, you're doing cloud wrong.

Of course, there is the idea of cloud agnostic, or even multi region, which seems a challenge for most places.

At least with terraform, it is theoretically easier to swing configurations over to a different host.

Re: "Hetzner decided to cancel our account and terminate all servers"

#196
I have a small number of very important servers on Hetzner and stories like this make me scared, but I haven't found a cost-effective equivalent for the "Storage Box" product - real block storage. I'm paying €11 a month for 5TB of storage. Is there any competition for that?

Re: "Hetzner decided to cancel our account and terminate all servers"

#197

Whenever I ask a CTO if they have a backup (or plan-B) they say we're on AWS, we backup there and they will never go down as a company. And then I ask them what they do when their account gets shut (e.g. because they are selling something bad on Amazon and have the same phone number as the company account?) Or the instance some years ago where GCP closed because someone had wrongly classified image on their drive? Yo…

They've gone the route of multiple AWS accounts in my company to avoid the issue they introduced with horrible planning. First they wanted us out of on-premise, and told us costs wouldn't matter. Then they wanted us to be 'cloud agnostic', but when given deadlines changed to 'get it working in AWS ASAP, doesn't matter the tech debt' Now they're freaking out about AWS costs, and we're back to juggling 'cloud agnostic'…

I would wager it’s not uncommon.

But also, the execs are the ones making the business risk decisions. Just make sure they have the correct info to make those decisions, the. Your responsibility is done.

Re: "Hetzner decided to cancel our account and terminate all servers"

#198

Whenever I ask a CTO if they have a backup (or plan-B) they say we're on AWS, we backup there and they will never go down as a company. And then I ask them what they do when their account gets shut (e.g. because they are selling something bad on Amazon and have the same phone number as the company account?) Or the instance some years ago where GCP closed because someone had wrongly classified image on their drive? Yo…

There should just be a legal duty placed on cloud providers to not do this. Nobody would expect you to hold a second redundant commercial lease for your offices or retail location.

This isn't a great example because buildings do have accidents like fires and floods. If you need business continuity you do plan on having multiple working locations.

Of course an accident is different than just randomly terminating service.

Re: "Hetzner decided to cancel our account and terminate all servers"

#199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I only use them for money-making projetcs. Based on my own experience and what I read online, you need to be careful with: * crypto mining (I used it when it wasn't causing much trouble but I noticed my nodes were constantly attacked at a ratio I newer saw for other servers); IIRC Hetzner's current ToS forbid crypto mining * things in legally grey area which might be legal in some places but not so in others, especia…

Their ToS forbids not just the crypto mining (that was extremely reasonable to ban ten years ago, but it's moot today) but also some arbitrary financial technologies they don't like. So beware of their ToS.

Is it really moot today given the current geopolitical landscape? I would assume not given they're based in Germany.

Re: "Hetzner decided to cancel our account and terminate all servers"

#200

Backups are irrelevent here (yes, backups are important). if hetzner really deleted production data without warning or providing a grace period for their customer to migrate their data, then they are simply not a stable foundation to build on. I have never been a customer of google cloud for this reason and i sure as hell wont deploy new servers on hetzner until they provide a clear statement on what went wrong and w…

> they are simply not a stable foundation to build on.

They're a budget host, you should always proceed with caution and never rely on for production. It's the same as buying a second hand eBay server to host users upon. I learnt that the hard way.

> Hetzner, the ball is in your court.

Not really. If you read the T&C, you'll find that they can do anything with the server.

From their T&C:

2.7. Furthermore, we reserve the right to terminate the contractual relationship without notice for good cause.

--

Any server with any company can do the same. There's been numerous stories of Amazon has doing the same. Same with Google.

Unless it's colocation or where you own the hardware you can be screwed in many ways.

I would never trust a dedicated server host.

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