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What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

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191–200 of 525 posts

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#191
post #25

The scary part is not the GPS installed by the fleet company that previously owned the car, which in all likelihood was just forgotten there, but the GPS and eSIM that comes with most (all?) new cars and that in most (all?) new cars cannot be disabled. Apart from privacy concerns of your data being used or sold by the car vendor, government outreach is also a concern. There was a bill announced in the US for all new…

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Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They’re not black boxes, you’re just not an electrical engineer. They’re actually way simpler than ICE in a bunch of ways that really improve reliability. We just need to develop a collective understanding of how electric drivetrains work, the kind of understanding that we had developed in previous generations for ICE cars

LOL, you should give it a try IRL: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41970406

Yeah I read that thread, it sounds like great progress! Really makes me think about the hardware I put out into the world professionally, and if I could realistically have reversed engineered it with no prior knowledge.

Cryptography is probably the real game changer here, secure boot, attestation, message authentication. Can’t exactly blame automakers for wanting those features, given the stakes, but that would make reverse engineering fairly impossible.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#193

> “can I get free data from the SIM card embedded in the device that I now technically own?” That seems like the next-most-interesting question now that you've determined what the device is. Possibly followed closely by "can I use that free-to-me data in a fun way that might teach the people who installed the SIM to deactivate their devices when they sell them?" i.e. Could you send and receive enough on the connectio…

If the people who made it know much about telecoms, then no, the will not work. When your mobile device connects to the Internet, the connection tunnels through the mobile network to a gateway specified by the "APN" (access point name). This is usually set up automatically these days, but you can dig the setting out of your phone. That's for an Internet connection - however a company can pay for a "private APN". This…

Cars now have cell modems that you can hook up to select telecom providers to turn your car into a hotspot, so those cell modems/SIMs do have an APN for internet data

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your ebike is limited because it can legally be operated by anybody (including a child) without needing any kind of license. If you want to legally operate a faster electric two-wheeled vehicle, take the test to get a motorbike license.

Is that why? I get up to multiples of that on a push bike every day. The kids that rip past me do too.

It's not why. That's just a talking point that gets repeated all too much. In most places you don't need a license to operate a boat and they go as fast as you can afford.

Despite what the other poster is saying, there's no law of physics that says speed can only be unlocked by licensing.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electric cars are essentially black boxes. When you take it apart, you have largely no idea what any of the chips do, even if you chase down what they're connected to. Is this the infotainment system or is it the infotainment system and a data gathering system that sends all my data off seas? There's no way to know. Old cars don't have that problem. Here's an engine, here's a gearbox, add a radio if you'd like, but b…

But that's not a gas vs. electric distinction, but rather an old vs. new one. Modern ICE cars have all of those problems too.

Yeah, its the same stuff that I've been told for decades now. TBH, it is probably less true with a lot of EVs than it was with the gas cars. ECUs are pretty strict and sometimes hard to hack.

Meanwhile, third party motor controllers for Tesla motors exist, and the batteries aren't exactly magic.

There's really nothing about electric drivetrains that makes anything vastly more locked down.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#196
post #25

The scary part is not the GPS installed by the fleet company that previously owned the car, which in all likelihood was just forgotten there, but the GPS and eSIM that comes with most (all?) new cars and that in most (all?) new cars cannot be disabled. Apart from privacy concerns of your data being used or sold by the car vendor, government outreach is also a concern. There was a bill announced in the US for all new…

Government overreach is the big thing that I'm worried about. All of the overreactions to adas is really heavily driving it. At some point, they will have to realize that the same attention systems used for adas could be used all of the time.

Given that there are hundreds of deaths each year due to inattention, it'd be almost irresponsible not to look into it.

But a lot of people won't like where that leads.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#197
post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not so. My mother bought a house in France in 1988. The previous owners had a mountain of stuff in the barn that they would come collect “soon”. 25 years passed. My mother started variously selling and disposing of their slowly rotting crap that they evidently were never going to collect, as she wanted to fix the structural issues with the barn, and their stuff was in the way, as it literally filled the entire ground…

That doesn’t make any sense. What would the value of that stuff be if she’d just moved it out of the barn and left it to rot there?

And how is there any record of what was in the barn, or how much it was worth, or either it has been stolen or collected by the owner any time in the past 30 years. I don't want to call OP a liar, but a lot of times when I hear outrageous stories like this the details are very different than what was provided.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Found it:

Coda EV Rav 4 EV Nissan Leaf Fiat 500e Smart Fortwo electric drive ... There's probably a dozen or so first-generation (well for this century) electric vehicles that are just regular cars that happen to have an electric power plant. The upside is that you can buy them used, for a couple grand. The downside is that they were manufactured with a 100 mile range, and your lucky if you can find one that still retains half…

I'm currently contemplating upgrading my 2013 Leaf battery to a 62Kwh (and much longer range). It's a substantial cost but that would extend the cars life another 15 years. (un)Fortunately I've taken decent care of the original 24Kwh which is at 80.6 SoH after 11 years. Its use case is daily commuter under 45 miles - that's over 11k miles/year (or 18k km/year). At 2% loss on the SoH, that's another 5 years before it hit's 70% and has a noticeable drop in range.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes but the point is, this technology is a blocker for people who might otherwise be interested in an electric powertrain vehicle. If you want an old car without all this crap, you can get one. But it pretty much has to be an ICE.

You can convert any ice car to an ev. I takes time but is straight forward

For various definitions of "you." That's far beyond the reach of the average consumer.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#200
post #25

The scary part is not the GPS installed by the fleet company that previously owned the car, which in all likelihood was just forgotten there, but the GPS and eSIM that comes with most (all?) new cars and that in most (all?) new cars cannot be disabled. Apart from privacy concerns of your data being used or sold by the car vendor, government outreach is also a concern. There was a bill announced in the US for all new…

> Media rushed to say it's not really a kill switch, just "sensors or cameras to monitor the driver’s behaviors, head or eye movements" and "block the driver from operating the vehicle". So... a kill switch. You're selectively quoting in a way that misrepresents the article. The post the article quotes: > “Joe Biden signed a bill that would give law enforcement access to a ‘kill switch’ that will be attached to ALL n…

So, it is a kill switch.

Just not the sort of kill switch that someone (who?) sometime (when?) described, and such description is one that you've neither quoted or given.

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