New iMac with M4 • Hacker News Board

Re: New iMac with M4

#191

Post by simonw » Mon, Oct 28, 2024, 4:16 PM UTC

klodolph wrote: post #156

simonw wrote: post #144

As someone who mucks around with running LLMs and other large models on my computer the 32GB maximum RAM is a show-stopper for me. I'm on a M2 with 64GB at the moment and I'm already regretting not going for 96 or even 128. I want to be able to run a large model AND other apps at the same time.

Sure, but to be honest, I don’t think you should be shipping a high-spec computer with a built-in screen. Anything high-spec should be broken into at least a separate screen and computer. The screen is such a major point of failure. I’ve seen so many iMacs and MacBooks with broken screens where the end solution is to replace the entire device, which is a waste. It’s that much more of a waste if you are getting a high…

Yeah, that's my biggest complaint with iMacs: I want to be 100% certain I can repurpose them as monitors later in their lives.

I have a ten year old iMac at the moment that would make an amazing second monitor... but it doesn't quite have the features I need to use it like that. An HDMI input would be great.

Re: New iMac with M4

#192

Post by seanmcdirmid » Mon, Oct 28, 2024, 4:16 PM UTC

klodolph wrote: post #156

simonw wrote: post #144

As someone who mucks around with running LLMs and other large models on my computer the 32GB maximum RAM is a show-stopper for me. I'm on a M2 with 64GB at the moment and I'm already regretting not going for 96 or even 128. I want to be able to run a large model AND other apps at the same time.

Sure, but to be honest, I don’t think you should be shipping a high-spec computer with a built-in screen. Anything high-spec should be broken into at least a separate screen and computer. The screen is such a major point of failure. I’ve seen so many iMacs and MacBooks with broken screens where the end solution is to replace the entire device, which is a waste. It’s that much more of a waste if you are getting a high…

> The screen is such a major point of failure.

The screen of an iMac (at least the 5K 27" one) is the part that still has value, so its annoying when you can't use it on new hardware.

Re: New iMac with M4

#193

Post by estebank » Mon, Oct 28, 2024, 4:16 PM UTC

epolanski wrote: post #103

baron816 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now if only they could figure out how to allow charging the Magic Mouse while it’s being used. I guess that technology is still years away.

You just reminded me of how stupid the plug beneath the MM was...You never needed to charge it, till you needed it and couldn't use the mouse.

I get what they were going for: force the user to use it as intended because the battery really lasted long enough for most people. Otherwise people would just have left it plugged always, and the cable+port would have needed different mechanical strength. But that really annoys anyone who would have left it charging if not most of the time. I think it would have been a better experience by leveraging software instead: detect that it is close to the end of the day and battery is low, and notify the user thwt they need to charge it when they stop using it, if leaving the underside port, or use notifications to annoy people into disconnecting the mouse when fully charged, if the port was moved to the obvious place. You're still annoying people, but you're less likely to end up with an unusable belly up mouse midway through your day.

Re: New iMac with M4

#194

Post by hggigg » Mon, Oct 28, 2024, 4:17 PM UTC

kbolino wrote: post #122

hggigg wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very easy. You sell it on eBay and buy a Logitech MX Master.

Does the Logitech MX Master come with a driver that overcomes Apple's "unintentional" hobbling of non-Magic mice?

It does. Although I don’t use it and use this instead: https://github.com/linearmouse/linearmouse

Re: New iMac with M4

#195

Post by hatsix » Mon, Oct 28, 2024, 4:17 PM UTC

mullsork wrote: post #124

aqme28 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you expected to replace your screen often? I don't think I upgrade and replace either one much faster than the other. Usually get a new monitor and a new PC every 4 or so years.

> Usually get a new monitor and a new PC every 4 or so years. Maybe you're not quite the average consumer that OP has in mind? Maybe you are, I don't know. Either way it's unsustainable and ridiculous that the _average consumer_ would need to replace something after 4 years when it COULD be built to last.

My first LCD monitor is still actively used in our house, about 18 years old now. My mother has gone through several computers, kept the same screen for 15 years. Apple Consumers are not "Average Consumers". Starting at $1300, it's a luxury desktop.

Re: New iMac with M4

#196

Post by Teever » Mon, Oct 28, 2024, 4:17 PM UTC

mjlee wrote: post #132

piinbinary wrote: post #11

It's frustrating how disposable these are designed to be edit: e.g. screen replacements cost nearly as much as the entire computer

Especially egregious when you consider older iMacs could be used as external displays - https://support.apple.com/en-gb/105126

I'd love to see a regulator mandate that computers like the iMac that have built in screens must have HDMI ports that allow them to be used as monitors.

This would be great for the consumer and prevent a lot of ewaste as people can use obsolete computers as monitors well past their useful lifespan as a monitor.

Re: New iMac with M4

#197

Post by bsimpson » Mon, Oct 28, 2024, 4:17 PM UTC

fourfour3 wrote: post #143

bradfitz wrote: post #2

I still miss the 27" iMacs. They were such a great form factor.

I've got one of the LG Ultrafine 5K monitors paired with a modern M1 Max macbook and it's a nice combination. Expensive, but I adore the pixel density considering I spend all day staring at text :) I'd be seriously tempted by an iMac if it had M4 Pro + a 27" 5K display. I just don't feel it's likely as they'll probably see it as cannibalising Mac Studio + Studio Display sales.

The Studio Display is priced as if it's an iMac.

It's insane that we've had retina displays for over a decade, and Apple still seems to be more-or-less the only game in town for a 5k 27" display.

Re: New iMac with M4

#198

Post by samatman » Mon, Oct 28, 2024, 4:17 PM UTC

mmastrac wrote: post #10

If 32GB is the max, why not just make that the one and only model and get rid of this weird segmentation. That's a ridiculously low minimum and only just barely adequate. 8GB was practically criminal. Or -- and I know this is crazy -- slottable RAM on a device that is designed for things other than portability. Wild, I know.

On the one hand, sure, Apple loves to get that extra margin for more RAM and SSD, no doubt.

On the other hand, the MacBook Air ships with 8GiB RAM standard, and it's robustly popular. One could suppose that all those customers are suffering from the lack of RAM, or one could suppose that for many use cases, it's an adequate amount.

The latter is more likely. macOS manages memory well, and a fast SSD means that swapping is fast enough that it often results in no visible delays to the user.

Re: New iMac with M4

#199

Post by sroussey » Mon, Oct 28, 2024, 4:17 PM UTC

porphyra wrote: post #92

thibaut_barrere wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So far the screens I've tested are more tiring to my eyes (I work both on a M1 13" with external screens, and on a legacy 27" iMac). What are the best 27" screens for coding comfort that work well with Macs these days?

Apart from the Samsung Viewfinity that another commenter mentioned, there's also the LG Ultrafine 5K and the Huawei Mateview. The MateView is nicer than other 4K monitors because it has a taller aspect ratio of 3840 x 2560 so the extra 400 pixels of vertical space is nice for productivity work, although of course this is still fewer total pixels than a 5K display.

LG Ultrafine 5K Has burn-in issues. :/

Re: New iMac with M4

#200

Post by foldr » Mon, Oct 28, 2024, 4:17 PM UTC

david_allison wrote: post #150

ChadNauseam wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve never felt memory limited on my 16gb macbook pro, on which I code, run rust-analyzer (major memory hog), video edit, etc. Most people definitely don’t need 32GB

My M1 MacBook is currently sitting at 46GB usage. It's not heavily under load (WebStorm, Rider, Android Studio, Chrome, Discord & Slack), not currently running an Android Emulator, LLM or Docker

The OS will use more RAM if you give it more RAM. The fact that you are currently using 46GB on an (I assume) 64GB model doesn't necessarily mean that your workload would run badly on a 32GB or 16GB model.