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Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

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Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reading this comment, it sounds to me that you live in a dystopian nightmare.

[flagged]

“Regularly” is not a particularly accurate word.

50 million K12 students in the U.S. — how many mass murders are “regular?”

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#193
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The education system in the US is broadly staffed by the dumbest people from every walk of life. If they could make it elsewhere, they would. I don’t expect this to be a popular take here, and most replies will be NAXALT fallacies, but in aggregate it’s the truth. Sorry, your retired CEO physics teacher who you loved was not a representative sample.

In Germany, you have to do the equivalent of a master's degree (and then a bunch) to teach in normal public schools

This selects for people willing to do 8 years of schooling to earn 60k EUR.

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#195
post #18

My daughter was accused of turning in an essay written by AI because the school software at her online school said so. Her mom watched her write the essay. I thought it was common knowledge that it was impossible to tell whether text was generated by AI. Evidently, the software vendors are either ignorant or are lying, and school administrators are believing them.

Imagine how little common knowledge there will be one or two generations down the road after people decide they no longer need general thinking skills, just as they've already decided calculators free them from having to care about arithmetic skills.

And yet, this fear is timeless; back when book printing was big, people were fearmongering that people would no longer memorize things but rely too much on books. But in hindsight it ended up becoming a force multiplier.

I mean I'm skeptical about AI as well and don't like it, but I can see it becoming a force multiplier itself.

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#197
post #178

It is no longer effective to solely use a written essay to measure how deeply a student comprehends a subject. AI is here to stay; new methods should be used to assess student performance. I remember being told at school, that we weren't allowed to use calculators in exams. The line provided by teachers was that we could never rely on having a calculator when we need it most—obviously there's irony associated with ha…

This is mostly true, but it is also important to recognize that “hey just invent a new evaluation methodology” is a rough thing to ask people to do immediately. People are trying to figure it out in a way that works.

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#198
post #178

It is no longer effective to solely use a written essay to measure how deeply a student comprehends a subject. AI is here to stay; new methods should be used to assess student performance. I remember being told at school, that we weren't allowed to use calculators in exams. The line provided by teachers was that we could never rely on having a calculator when we need it most—obviously there's irony associated with ha…

> AI is here to stay; new methods should be used to assess student performance.

This is overdue - we should be using interactive technology and not boring kids to death with a whiteboards.

Bureaucracy works to protect itself and protect ease of administration. Even organising hand on practical lessons is harder

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#199
post #178

It is no longer effective to solely use a written essay to measure how deeply a student comprehends a subject. AI is here to stay; new methods should be used to assess student performance. I remember being told at school, that we weren't allowed to use calculators in exams. The line provided by teachers was that we could never rely on having a calculator when we need it most—obviously there's irony associated with ha…

> I remember being told at school, that we weren't allowed to use calculators in exams

I remember being told the same thing, but I happen to believe that it was a fantastic policy, with a lackluster explanation. The idea that you wouldn't have a calculator was obviously silly, even at the time, but underlying observation that relying on the calculator would rob you of the mental exercise the whole ordeal was supposed to be was accurate. The problem is that you can't explain to a room full of 12 year olds that math is actually beautiful and that the systems principles it imparts fundamentally shape how you view the world.

The same goes for essays. I hated writing essays, and I told myself all sort of weird copes about how I would never need to write an essay. The truth, that I've observed much later, is that structured thinking is exactly what the essay forced me to do. The essay was not a tool to asses my ability in a subject. It was a tool for me to learn. Writing the essay was part of the learning.

I think that's what a lot of this "kids don't need to calculate in their heads" misses. Being able to do the calculation was only ever part of the idea. Learning that you could learn how to do the calculation was at least as important.

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