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Routine dental X-rays are not backed by evidence

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Re: Routine dental X-rays are not backed by evidence

#191

Post by fazeirony »

ein0p wrote: post #190
FollowingTheDao wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two stories. 1) Just yesterday I went to a an acclaimed dental school (UNC) for low cost dental care. They not only gave me a panoramic x ray but also a full set of bite-wing x rays. I read this and I want to break the world apart this morning. 2) When I was a child I kep needing root canals. It turned out our dentist was making these all up and was later found passed out from laughing gas in his office.

I strongly suspect my dentist is making shit up, too. I had to refuse a couple of expensive treatments. The main goal seems to be to “use up” my dental insurance more than anything.

this is it right here - 'use up your dental insurance'.

Re: Routine dental X-rays are not backed by evidence

#192

Post by throw4950sh06 »

viraptor wrote: post #186
throw4950sh06 wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You said the same thing I said... You only get basic care to survive, nothing else. The system is different but this aspect is pretty much the same everywhere around here.

Having a repeating free review and treatment is above basic care to survive. Both compared to many other places in the world now and historically.

I very much disagree, that's the most basic of basics. I don't care much what's happening in low income areas and especially not how it used to be historically. And the point is what happens when an issue is discovered - it's nice that they do checkups, it's not so nice that the treatment available is again only the most basic available and anything above is very expensive and not covered even partially.

Re: Routine dental X-rays are not backed by evidence

#193

Post by dartos »

ein0p wrote: post #190
FollowingTheDao wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two stories. 1) Just yesterday I went to a an acclaimed dental school (UNC) for low cost dental care. They not only gave me a panoramic x ray but also a full set of bite-wing x rays. I read this and I want to break the world apart this morning. 2) When I was a child I kep needing root canals. It turned out our dentist was making these all up and was later found passed out from laughing gas in his office.

I strongly suspect my dentist is making shit up, too. I had to refuse a couple of expensive treatments. The main goal seems to be to “use up” my dental insurance more than anything.

My dad has been a dentist for 30+ years and retired a few years ago.

Recently he did some 3-month contract work for a very large dental chain, let’s call it Penass.

I’ve never seen him so depressed in my live. He said that Penass’s business model was all about running up insurance and selling loans for large operations. He was directly encouraged to do extra, not necessary work to run up the bill.

He came out of retirement after that and started another practice out of, what I can only guess, was frustration and guilt.

A lot of these large dental chains absolutely tack on extra work and do a shitty job to keep people coming back.

In the US, I highly recommend looking for independent “boutique” dentists. Even if they are out of your insurance network, a lot of them will give better rates if you pay in cash.

Re: Routine dental X-rays are not backed by evidence

#194

Post by Eumenes »

Routine dental work is not backed by evidence. Water pick, floss, brush, high quality mouth wash 2-3x per day = no need for dentist. Reduce your sugar and fake food consumption. Don't smoke or drink alcohol. There's a famous blog post of some guy who went to a ton of dentists and got like 100 different diagnosis/cost, can't find it though.

Re: Routine dental X-rays are not backed by evidence

#195

Post by matwood »

andsens wrote: post #164
pprotas wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not directly related to the topic at hand, but it amazes me how Dutch healthcare insurance does not cover dental care by default, and you have to get an extra package for that. As if dental health is not part of my regular health? Why are teeth treated differently from the rest of the body?

Here’s a good answer that tracks with what my parents, who are dentists, told me: https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/s/H4MsnWKatM > For the longest time, surgeons, dentists and optometrists weren't part of the medical profession. You'd have a barber who could give you a shave or pull your teeth, or a butcher who could cut up a hog, or cut off your gangrenous leg. Optometrists were craftsmen who made the spect…

A friend of mine is an orthopedic surgeon and says he's basically a carpenter.

Re: Routine dental X-rays are not backed by evidence

#196

Post by robocat »

throwaway2037 wrote: post #132
ninalanyon wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those prices are absurd. My whole annual check up including a digital X-ray, visual inspection, tartar removal, polishing, costs less than that. And that is in high cost Norway.

How much did it cost? If _much_ lower than 200 USD per visit in a very wealthy country, then I assume: (a) dentists don't make very much money. Less than 100K USD? (b) most of the work is done by poorly paid dental assistants (20 USD per hour or less). Running a high quality dental clinic is expensive, both for equipment and staff. How can it be so cheap in Norway?

My dentist in New Zealand is about USD200 every six months for the gold plated option. The x-ray is free. Dentists are relatively well paid in New Zealand. Looks like helping hygienist gets USD25-USD30 per hour. Minimum wage in NZ is about USD14/hr for unskilled labour or poorly paying food service jobs.

My friend is getting an implant and the total cost is about USD8000. The government is covering most of it because it was an accident (sporting).

Re: Routine dental X-rays are not backed by evidence

#197

Post by MVissers »

matwood wrote: post #195
andsens wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here’s a good answer that tracks with what my parents, who are dentists, told me: https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/s/H4MsnWKatM > For the longest time, surgeons, dentists and optometrists weren't part of the medical profession. You'd have a barber who could give you a shave or pull your teeth, or a butcher who could cut up a hog, or cut off your gangrenous leg. Optometrists were craftsmen who made the spect…

A friend of mine is an orthopedic surgeon and says he's basically a carpenter.

Doc here. They are basically carpenters. They us drills and saws and hammers and stuff.

Re: Routine dental X-rays are not backed by evidence

#198

Post by matwood »

Eumenes wrote: post #194

Routine dental work is not backed by evidence. Water pick, floss, brush, high quality mouth wash 2-3x per day = no need for dentist. Reduce your sugar and fake food consumption. Don't smoke or drink alcohol. There's a famous blog post of some guy who went to a ton of dentists and got like 100 different diagnosis/cost, can't find it though.

I think the invention of the SonicCare style toothbrush is what really put the dentists under pressure. Cavities dropped and they lost one of their main money makers. It's after that when I really started noticing car salesman like tactics for extra services.

Re: Routine dental X-rays are not backed by evidence

#199

Post by FollowingTheDao »

ein0p wrote: post #190
FollowingTheDao wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two stories. 1) Just yesterday I went to a an acclaimed dental school (UNC) for low cost dental care. They not only gave me a panoramic x ray but also a full set of bite-wing x rays. I read this and I want to break the world apart this morning. 2) When I was a child I kep needing root canals. It turned out our dentist was making these all up and was later found passed out from laughing gas in his office.

I strongly suspect my dentist is making shit up, too. I had to refuse a couple of expensive treatments. The main goal seems to be to “use up” my dental insurance more than anything.

A private psychiatric hospital did this to me. I was voluntarily committed and they kept me for 10 days because that is how long Medicare would pay for. I was literally fine after the second day. Meanwhile a poor kid with horrible delusions was let out after three days after being involuntarily commuted and was still having active hallucinations. He had no healthcare at all.

The hospital has been under intense investigation by the local news.

https://www.wral.com/holly-hill-hospital/21507953/

This is the newest scam running, privatize health care so that these companies can rake in billions. I am sure this dental school probably gets millions for doing this.

Re: Routine dental X-rays are not backed by evidence

#200

Post by FollowingTheDao »

fazeirony wrote: post #191
ein0p wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I strongly suspect my dentist is making shit up, too. I had to refuse a couple of expensive treatments. The main goal seems to be to “use up” my dental insurance more than anything.

this is it right here - 'use up your dental insurance'.

And it is the biggest reason we need universal healthcare.
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