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PHP Addiction

marco.org

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191–200 of 320 posts

Re: PHP Addiction

#191

Post by antihero »

jmduke wrote: post #7

I'll sound like a broken record, but I'm convinced Flask is the perfect transition. It's built for smaller web apps, and rapid prototyping. The system of mapping endpoints to functions is incredibly intuitive -- if you've used Python before, learning Flask is incredibly easy.

Yep, I mean, I think Django is generally a better solution for the average website, as there are many site-related problems that the Django team have had many years to solve, as opposed to you re-solving them with Flask in a few months, however, then you have to learn Python and you have to learn Django.

With Flask, you just have to learn Python, as Flask is so mindfuckingly simple.

Re: PHP Addiction

#192

Post by mmackh »

cletus wrote: post #121

Is it my imagination or is Marco the king of writing blog posts that are quick reactions to whatever is trending on HN? The message you should get from this post is that familiarity with one's tools easily trumps any aesthetic flaws (consistency in parameter ordering, naming conventions, etc are really nothing more than aesthetic flaws and not "deep" [1] as the author suggests. After all, human language is inconsiste…

>Is it my imagination or is Marco the king of writing blog posts that are quick reactions to whatever is trending on HN?

From the impression I get of Marco whilst listening to his Build and Analyze podcast, is that he does have a lot to say about the technical aspects of his work. However when he does, it is often written/spoken out as a response to a question. The constant talk about PHP in recent weeks has probably triggered something he's been thinking about for years.

Re: PHP Addiction

#193

Post by j_baker »

maratd wrote: post #180
j_baker wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_fallacy Just because a technology is "cool" doesn't mean that you're acting like a high schooler for using it. Nor does using non-"cool" technology make you an adult.

I would think that not quoting Wikipedia articles in a conversation makes you an adult, but what do I know ...

I'm assuming you don't have any arguments left because you're needling me on my wikipedia link rather than addressing anything I actually said. If that's the case, you're really not adding anything constructive to this conversation.

Re: PHP Addiction

#194

Post by lucian1900 »

valeh wrote: post #147
lucian1900 wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people (myself included) find Java too limiting. Many others like it. But even Java is so much better than PHP. If you like it, go for it.

Actually, I find Python and Ruby much more interesting than Java (actually, Java seems as a boring language :) ) . But since Java is general purpose language and it's known as market skill, I want go for it.

Python and Ruby are both general purpose languages, and both also run on the JVM.

Knowledge of Java can be useful though, as terrible as the language is.

Re: PHP Addiction

#195

Post by espeed »

pcwalton wrote: post #182
espeed wrote: post #154

The fear of making the "wrong" choice actually makes the familiar, mastered PHP more attractive. The multi-core reality means that the long-term languages will have a strong concurrency model. Clojure and Go are two languages with strong concurrency models that are building momentum and have potential to go mainstream. But for your first foray out of PHP, I would pick a language that has a large, well-established com…

I think that multicore support is unlikely to be the crucial feature that cements the success of the language of the future for simple CRUD web apps. Such apps are invariably not CPU-bound. Wide support on hosting providers, tooling, ease for novices, database access, etc. are far more important--which explains the success of PHP in the first place.

Multicore will drive the development of languages in general, and this will bring with it the libraries and ecosystem.

So if you're stuck in limbo trying to "make the right choice," concurrency is the feature that you should pay attention to because it will bring the dominant language in years to come, even if the CRUD devs don't use it directly.

And who knows what the basic Web app of the future will be, it may not be CRUD forever.

Re: PHP Addiction

#196

Post by pbiggar »

cletus wrote: post #121

Is it my imagination or is Marco the king of writing blog posts that are quick reactions to whatever is trending on HN? The message you should get from this post is that familiarity with one's tools easily trumps any aesthetic flaws (consistency in parameter ordering, naming conventions, etc are really nothing more than aesthetic flaws and not "deep" [1] as the author suggests. After all, human language is inconsiste…

> Linux (over OSX) does actually have a package system (it's a messy hack on OSX)

I wonder if you've tried homebrew? It's really really good, esp compared to the horrors of MacPorts.

Re: PHP Addiction

#197

Post by hyuuu »

tfb wrote: post #188

I switched from PHP to node.js and haven't looked back since. And I know node has its shortcomings, but in time I have no doubt that they will be sorted out. Right now it does absolutely everything I need it to do and more. A huge part of node's appeal to me (and many others, I'm sure) was the fact that I already knew javascript. Making the switch couldn't have been easier. I used to defend PHP; but now when I look a…

I was in the same boat, until I do complex node.js projects, do you use fibers etc? To get around the boomerang code?

Re: PHP Addiction

#198

Post by tom_m »

banana_bread wrote: post #112
tom_m wrote: post #104

The only thing flawed with PHP is your outlook on it. People with money (investors, clients, etc.) don't care about ANY of the nuances mentioned here or by Jeff Atwood. At the end of the day, we use PHP and are rewarded for doing so. If you want to use another language or make a new one...Great. Do it. But I'm not sure why some people just want to try to change an entire industry and move people off of PHP... It make…

In a few years most NEW projects will probably not be made in PHP. You are suffering from Cognitive Dissonance, PHP is not good.

Uh... You're quite wrong about that statement. If I could find you in real life I'd love to make $1,000 bet with you.

Re: PHP Addiction

#199

Post by mistercow »

crazygringo wrote: post #168
Legion wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The only thing actually wrong with PHP, is that it's popular but not cool. No, what's "wrong" with PHP is that other things that are better have come along since. That's not a fault of PHP, that's the nature of language evolution. > It runs half the Internet quite well COBOL runs tons of mission critical business services quite well. It doesn't mean that nobody's improved on COBOL or that you should use it for a ne…

> No, what's "wrong" with PHP is that other things that are better have come along since. The problem is, no, nothing else has. Node.js is awesome and fun, but far harder to set up for basic webpage serving. Python is awesome, but also has a huge learning curve to learn how to serve basic webpages with. And... I can't think of anything else. Perl? ASP? Java is a huge pain to set up and maintain. What other language o…

>The problem is, no, nothing else has. Node.js is awesome and fun, but far harder to set up for basic webpage serving. Python is awesome, but also has a huge learning curve to learn how to serve basic webpages with. And... I can't think of anything else. Perl? ASP? Java is a huge pain to set up and maintain.

The crazy thing is that all of that could change with a simple project that does (or whatever) style templating while automatically offering access to CGI data and cookies at a scope reasonably close to the global one. This should take days to implement, and when I have a few of those to spare, I plan to tackle it.

Re: PHP Addiction

#200

Post by Ralith »

ijoyce wrote: post #99
maratd wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Common sense. Calculate how much traffic Wikipedia + Facebook + Wordpress + All The Rest generate. Calculate in the fact that most services talk to other services and more importantly, talk to Facebook. Click on a link? I promise, at some point, PHP is involved.

When you actually have a real source or numbers, let me know.

Not to mention that the web is not the internet.
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