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Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

curingaddiction.substack.com

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Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#191

Post by [deleted] »

throwup238 wrote: post #172
lamontcg wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does the layman consumer inspect/assess the quality/safety of other drugs or really any other substance that they ingest?

That's a fair question - they obviously can't inspect pharmaceutical factories. That said, the FDA has much more power to regulate drug manufacturers than pharmacists and most drugs are manufactured in a few locations that are much easier to inspect. They only have to make sure one or two locations are set up correctly and a significant chunk of the application for clinical trials is quality control procedures.

[deleted]

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#192

Post by Eddy_Viscosity2 »

raziel2701 wrote: post #17

Ozempic costs $1000/month (in the US) but $5/month to manufacture [0]. I think if this drug and others are to have a significant anti-consumption effect on other companies it needs to be vastly more accessible, which first requires more accessible healthcare in the US, which is unlikely to happen. Also it's an injection, which raises the barrier. If drugs like these become orally administered and over-the-counter, th…

The fact that its $1000/month only increases its anti-consumption effects because people will have that much less each month to spend on alcholol/candy/cigarettes....

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#193

Post by chpatrick »

jart wrote: post #75
kelseyfrog wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Sounds really bad" is orthogonal to "is really bad". There's a heuristic that goes, "Shortcuts will catch up to people eventually," but I'm ok with letting the evidence bear that out.

Yeah that's the kind of folk wisdom that causes people with psychiatric conditions to stop taking their medications. It's very ignorant and harmful.

I don't think that's a fair analogy. Psychiatric medications don't have a non-pharmacological alternative in many cases. You can't just consciously do something and not be depressed or schizophrenic any more.

However, putting food in your mouth is a completely conscious decision. If people have problems with controlling that then I think that's what should be treated, instead of medicating your body to react to food differently. I think a future where we turn to drugs on an ongoing basis to compensate our unhealthy lifestyles is pretty dystopic.

Again, if someone is obese and struggles to lose weight I think Ozempic sounds like a great way to get on the road to health. I just don't think you should take it for the rest of your life instead of changing your lifestyle.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#194

Post by coremoff »

wffurr wrote: post #94
neither_color wrote: post #40

Many years ago as a teen I worked seasonally at a big blue/yellow electronics store that sells TVs, computers, appliances....and candy at the register. Curious, I asked my manager about it. "Oh yeah, someone comes in here to buy a $10 HDMI cable, and impulse buys a $2 candy bar at checkout. Instant 20% more sales. Gas stations, pharmacies, they all do it."

It ought to be illegal. Ideally I could choose to shop somewhere that didn’t do that, but like your boss said, they all do it. It makes shopping with small children hellish.

the UK is supposed to have made it illegal to have unhealthy stuff etc. near checkouts and illegal to include them in certain promos (e.g. buy-one-get-one-free) - I thought it had passed into law years ago, but when I had a quick look it isn't even due to take effected until 2025 and until then everyone is ignoring it anyway.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#195

Post by jncfhnb »

abruzzi wrote: post #97
jncfhnb wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m reminded of the bit in 1984 where they’re trying to remove the pleasure from orgasms. I don’t entirely disagree that this would be good to make accessible but removing the joy from eating is so bleak

It doesn't remove the joy, just the need. The first thing I noticed after starting is I wasn't hungry all the time. That constant sense of hunger made me eat when I didn't need to. Now I can eat a nice meal, but much of the time I don't feel a need to eat, so I don't. Edit just to add that in 10 months I've lost 40lbs and halved my insulin usage. That insulin is the pricy synthetic stuff (Tresiba and Novolog), so the…

Is that really true? Everyone I’ve talked to has suggested they don’t really enjoy high reward food anymore and so they end up eating healthier. In part because nutritious food tastes comparatively better.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#196

Post by slfnflctd »

trogdor wrote: post #180
slfnflctd wrote: post #24

If these drugs turn out to be significantly more effective for a wide range of addictions than past approaches, that would indeed be a major societal shift. I wouldn't try any of them right now, but if my insurance covered one for treating alcoholism at some point I'd give it a shot. If it actually worked it would likely significantly improve not only my life experience, but also my productivity and thereby the lives…

Have you considered naltrexone?

I appreciate the thoughtful suggestion. I have not actually tried it, but I've read many accounts from other alcoholics trying to quit who have done so (among a couple dozen other approaches), and came to the conclusion that it's not for me right now. If I did give it a chance I would probably have to go with an implant, which I would only do under extreme circumstances.

What it boils down to is that on some level, I often feel death would be preferable to not being able to experience the 'reward' my brain has been long conditioned to expect from my next drink. If there was a lasting way to shift that to something healthier it would be miraculous. Simply taking it away would just drive me to despair. Having attempted suicide in the past, I do everything I can to avoid that situation again, and unfortunately drinking became a big part of this effort.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#197

Post by johncearls »

makeitdouble wrote: post #182
pseudalopex wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why quotation marks around loss? Why does it feel like recommending meth? Are they similar in addiction and harmful effects?

Because the loss is very limited, and most people regain after stopping medication. As discussed in the other thread, within about a year or so there's already a two thirds rebound, and patients don't see as much health improvement as through exercice for instance.

And my cholesterol goes back up when I stop taking statins. I don’t get this very common argument.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#198

Post by hollerith »

slfnflctd wrote: post #196
trogdor wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you considered naltrexone?

I appreciate the thoughtful suggestion. I have not actually tried it, but I've read many accounts from other alcoholics trying to quit who have done so (among a couple dozen other approaches), and came to the conclusion that it's not for me right now. If I did give it a chance I would probably have to go with an implant, which I would only do under extreme circumstances. What it boils down to is that on some level, I…

In a Youtube video {Leveraging Dopamine, 2023}, neuroscientist Andrew Huberman defines addiction as "a progressive narrowing of the things that bring us pleasure".

I worry that framing the goal as, "a lasting way to shift that to something healthier", will prime you to switch from one addiction to another. I would prefer for you to frame it as diversifying the sources of pleasure in your life and becoming able to take pleasure (and consequent to take interest) in practical things that you currently experience as tedious obstacles that must be endured so that you can get your next drink.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#199

Post by jart »

chpatrick wrote: post #193
jart wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah that's the kind of folk wisdom that causes people with psychiatric conditions to stop taking their medications. It's very ignorant and harmful.

I don't think that's a fair analogy. Psychiatric medications don't have a non-pharmacological alternative in many cases. You can't just consciously do something and not be depressed or schizophrenic any more. However, putting food in your mouth is a completely conscious decision. If people have problems with controlling that then I think that's what should be treated, instead of medicating your body to react to food…

What you call dystopia, I call paradise. Evolution didn't give us bodies that are adapted to life in modern technological society. The better technology gets, the more unnatural the world gets for our bodies. People who are unfit to live won't die, because technology breaks the evolutionary process. Since we know that technology is better, the only way we can keep having it and thrive is by using more technology to hack our bodies so they're adapted for existence in the modern world.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#200

Post by NoGravitas »

cactusplant7374 wrote: post #170
pixl97 wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tobacco and meth happen to be some of the most highly addictive drugs that exist, that also have the side effect of weight loss. I don't think I've seen anybody tweaking out for a fix of ozempic, though please feel free to inform me if addiction is an actual side effect that I've not heard of.

Withdrawal for tobacco is basically mild discomfort. It can't be in the same class as drugs that cause seizures, profuse sweating, and death upon immediate cessation.

Depends what you mean by mild. For me, going cold turkey from nicotine was migraines, severe anxiety, irritability, and fatigue. Not life threatening, but I was unable to function. That said, tapering off with a controlled time-release dosage (patches) was sufficient to reduce it to actual mild discomfort for me.
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