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Show HN: I made an app that consolidated 18 apps (doc, sheet, form, site, chat…)

nino.app

191–200 of 269 posts

Re: Show HN: I made an app that consolidated 18 apps (doc, sheet, form, site, chat…)

#191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Single biggest technical thing, anyway. IMO, the single biggest thing is focus and clarity in their communication. If people without a working mental model of software development can’t instantly understand the tangible problem it solves in their existing business process, they won’t even scroll past the break, let alone pay for it. Consolidation and modularity are solutions, but people don’t go shopping for solution…

Fair point. I know little to nothing about design, and don’t really care about it. It’s not that I think it’s unimportant, it’s just not something I want to expend any time learning. To be fair, I’m also not trying to create any user-facing products. To me, rsync.net is peak design. It has just enough modernity to appeal to people who might expect that, but it quickly gets out of the way and tells you what it is, why…

There’s less than no shame in not having expertise in something outside of your area of expertise, and realizing that’s the case puts you way ahead of the pack. There’s a reason most designers you work with have relevant degrees, and the ones that don’t that are in high level positions in good organizations might as well have them— it’s just a lot more complex than most developers assume. When they realize that, great! When they’re swinging around giant Dunning-Krueger derived overconfident declarations about something you’re designing… not so great.

As a full-time developer for a decade, and in other technical roles for a decade before that, I had a few similar experiences with designers. One repeatedly insisted that Wordpress along with their ramshackle loopdy-looped spaghetti php plugin (still including comments from the tutorials they copied tidbits of code from) was robust enough to enough to replace our very tight Django-based code base that did a hell of a lot more than serve up our website… but they insisted it would take half as long to reimplement it all in php. There wasn’t even a good reason for it– they learned everything they knew about development by osmosis from working on web projects, and a mishmash of articles they read on the topic over the years, and after getting one piece of code to work in a low volume application, thought they were a dual-field specialist. That’s actually pretty rare among designers, but developers that feel that way about design are the norm. We all know what Larry Wall thought the three most important traits were for developers…

Re: Show HN: I made an app that consolidated 18 apps (doc, sheet, form, site, chat…)

#192

Looks great! Unfortunately I couldn't manage to log in. I signed up, pressed on "create workspace" and for a verification link. Where do I set a password to log in? Also, did you create this using Flutter?

Probably it is, based on the platforms it supports this early.

Re: Show HN: I made an app that consolidated 18 apps (doc, sheet, form, site, chat…)

#193
post #190

Single biggest thing you need to nail down fast: the data model. It is extremely hard to shift as things grow, and without careful thought, it’ll turn into a horrifying miasma of JSONB columns, duplicated data, orphaned rows, and garbage performance. Customers are going to store surprisingly large items in Docs, where you’d be tempted to inline them instead of offloading to S3 et al. Chat practically needs to be its…

The problem with modern development is having to nail down the data model first. I wish we would develop software where the data model could easily change. To do this every data dependency in the system needs to traceable. Nothing does this so far. And everyone just picks a database off the shelf but none are even remotely useful for this.

Admittedly, yes. This is the massive appeal of Mongo et al., or just JSON[B] columns in an RDBMS.

Unfortunately, at a very deep level, that’s simply not how RDBMS works. The tuples are a B+tree, and in some (MySQL [InnoDB], SQL Server) cases everything is clustered around the PK. If you don’t create a data model that’s easily exploitable for optimizations designed around that data structure, you’re gonna have a bad time. It’s no different than if you decided to use strings to store ints – you _can_, but it’s a bad idea for a variety of reasons.

What you can do is give yourself as much leeway as possible, by following some basic best practices. For example, it’s a hell of a lot easier to update a tiny reference table than to update billions of rows when you decide that column `region` should say `European Union` instead of `EU`.

Re: Show HN: I made an app that consolidated 18 apps (doc, sheet, form, site, chat…)

#194
My favorite parts are site and blog. Had some requests for websites and blogs and I like the idea, that it comes with a lot of other stuff integrated. I could offer this to my clients as a solution, but... It needs an e-commerce and a payment solution, at least with debit/credit cards. I saw you don't want to integrate external services, but this would make it a lot easier to sell the platform to businesses.

Re: Show HN: I made an app that consolidated 18 apps (doc, sheet, form, site, chat…)

#195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Single biggest technical thing, anyway. IMO, the single biggest thing is focus and clarity in their communication. If people without a working mental model of software development can’t instantly understand the tangible problem it solves in their existing business process, they won’t even scroll past the break, let alone pay for it. Consolidation and modularity are solutions, but people don’t go shopping for solution…

Nailed the real important part, the product marketing

It can sting to realize your grand, genuinely useful technical idea won’t sell itself, but it just won’t.

Re: Show HN: I made an app that consolidated 18 apps (doc, sheet, form, site, chat…)

#196
post #160
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually think this hyper-granular realtime collaboration like in Google docs is slightly overrated. I think it’s ok to have more a git-like workflow where feedback and changes happen over cycles. As a programmer, I don’t give a shit about your working directory. I do care, however, about your commits :) All I’m saying is this CRDT craze isn’t always necessary or even appropriate for many products. It adds a lot of…

Realtime collab apps tend to kill their competitors without realtime collab. See Figma: slightly worse UX and performance compared to Sketch, easily killed Sketch. How did Notion penetrate the competitive docs/wiki market? Much more collaborative than the incumbent Confluence (now confluence is iterating on realtime collab to remain relevant). Realtime is becoming table stakes in any online collab system. I think cod…

You are absolutely right. I am in the minority, no doubt. My POV is that standard corporate realtime collaboration is generally a waste of time, personally. Or at the very least, the results always reek of design-by-committee - inconsistencies and compromises. This is independent of tech, and I would say the same about the 2000s white boarding and mindmapping. Sometimes, there are cases where it works, like an 1:1 session with someone you can really vibe with. But even in those cases, it’s usually better with single-control (ie only one person editing at a time).

I’m perfectly fine talking about work on a high level, but when it gets too gritty it’s usually better to sit down in quiet and solve the problem or improve the design on your own. (Needless to say, I did not exactly thrive in a corporate environment.)

So to me realtime collab can be very neat, but it’s not a common enough use-case to be a dealbreaker. That said, there’s tremendous value in being able to easily view, comment, duplicate, copy the latest version that others publish, in read-only mode. Perhaps the success of Figma etc is partly also because of that?

Re: Show HN: I made an app that consolidated 18 apps (doc, sheet, form, site, chat…)

#197
post #91

Ok, lots of thoughts. I’ve reviewed the website and started drafted this as a Nino Doc. Haven’t dug into the more complex functionality yet. # Tactical Feedback On iOS, my password manager doesn’t recognize the Nino app with the Nino.app domain, so autofill doesn’t work at login. Not a problem, just a little friction. Breaking problem on iOS: I cannot type the letter “m”. It appears to trigger a keyboard shortcut tha…

Thanks for finding the letter "m" bug, an embarrassing one for sure! Also thanks for bringing up the issue of select all on mobile, I'll think about how to improve that. Adding a tag line for each module is also a good idea.

Interesting that you mentioned fine-grained security. Currently block-level access control can be achieved with block embeds, but it has to be done one by one. I looked into enforcing access based on a query for page embeds (so allowing only portions of the page), it turned out to be non-trivial! Might try to implement in the future.

Thanks for breaking down the different levels of self-hosting. I'll keep them in mind.

Re: Show HN: I made an app that consolidated 18 apps (doc, sheet, form, site, chat…)

#198
it's nice that everything is integrated into one system! I have always been searching for similar solutions. But one thing that bothers me email. If I use an email provider from Google workspace or Microsoft365, then sooner or later I was forced to use their calendar, and soon docs because the preview and integration.

The closest I found is larksuite[0] which they recently added email hosting. But I am still paying microsoft so I haven't switched email. I just use lark's IM as email client as well.

While I am trying the product, I am curious what's your thought about add email hosting.

[0] https://www.larksuite.com/

Re: Show HN: I made an app that consolidated 18 apps (doc, sheet, form, site, chat…)

#200

I would love to know a little more about your tech stack and architecture? You say "Everything is saved locally by default", with full office support. Essentially you have built a "local-first" app, or about 10 of them! I would definitely play on that for marketing, the local-first place is getting quite a bit of buzz. (I'm biased, but I think 2024 if the year local-first is going to go mainstream) What tech are you…

It's on GCP and 99% "serverless" with TypeScript + React frontend. Flutter for mobile apps and Electron for desktop apps (planning to switch the desktop apps to Flutter too once their desktop frameworks are more stable) Noted on the "local-first" term, thanks! I thought about doing CRDT in the beginning, but because not every block type is text, I simplified the implementation to last write wins. Note that every para…

Have you thought about use flutter for web as well? It seems a lot of effort to maintain 2 codebase for web and desktop
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