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Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

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Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#191

Post by 1024core »

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #2

The prize is supposedly awarded to those who have "done the most or the best work for fraternity between nations, for the abolition or reduction of standing armies and for the holding and promotion of peace congresses." Hmmm. Well. I don't quite see how formenting revolution fits the bill, but the Peace Prize has been very strange of late in general. By its own lights, I don't see a single person or entity who would…

You could say the same about Ang San Suu Kyi. Or Nelson Mandela, for that matter.

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#192

Post by mrguyorama »

screye wrote: post #134
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could at least make the case that Obama promoted -- indeed, in a sense, embodied -- "fraternity between nations," for he was incredibly popular with most of America's allies. (See, e.g., his "rock star" reception in Germany.) Even its enemies were at worst ambivalent towards him personally, and at best they were hopeful that he'd bring about positive change. In this sense, he, at minimum, shored up the self-image…

The mishandling of the entire middle-east is hard to ignore. If anything, Trump's only consensus wins came from cleaning up the mess in the middle east. > shored up the self-image of the Western world Which tells you everything you need to about the Nobel Peace Prize.

>cleaning up the mess in the middle east.

Pray tell, how did Trump clean up anything in the middle east?

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#193

Post by 1024core »

pipo234 wrote: post #12
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #2

The prize is supposedly awarded to those who have "done the most or the best work for fraternity between nations, for the abolition or reduction of standing armies and for the holding and promotion of peace congresses." Hmmm. Well. I don't quite see how formenting revolution fits the bill, but the Peace Prize has been very strange of late in general. By its own lights, I don't see a single person or entity who would…

The Nobel Peace Prize has historically been surrounded by the kind of ambivalent feelings you allude to. To name one: Hume & Trimble (1998) was considered ironic because it was viewed as kind of reward for ceasing violence they initially caused. Similar remarks were made in 1993 about Mandela and De Klerk. It can even be argued that Gorbachev and Carter had blood on their hands before becoming saints. Maybe this kind…

Don't forget Obama. He was given the prize before he even did anything.

And then he proceeded to bomb the fuck out of Iraq, Syria, etc.

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#194

Post by AlbertCory »

wheelerof4te wrote: post #17
zvmaz wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Well. I don't quite see how formenting revolution fits the bill Oppressive regimes like to use these sorts of rhetorical ploys to discredit social movements. Do people under authoritarian regimes have any agency? Or are they just puppets to foreign machinations?

"social movements." LOL, try harder. NGOs paid by the westerners are a thing, but you sure know that. If these people did not get free money for their actions, they would be silent. "Do people under authoritarian regimes have any agency?" "Authoritarian regimes" usually have popular support since a huge majority supports the ruling party. Otherwise, the country would not be stable and vast sums of western money would…

There's a simple test of"a huge majority supports the ruling party":

Have a fair election, where both sides are permitted to make their case to the voting public. No candidates or supporters would be imprisoned or legally harassed, before or after the election.

Then have another one a year or two later, since "your vote actually counts" would be a teaching moment for people who aren't used to it.

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#195

Post by fauigerzigerk »

shihab wrote: post #145
fauigerzigerk wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>For some reason, I don't see the award ever going to a rights activist fighting against the Saudi, Pakistani, or any other American-allied regimes. There have been a few, such as https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasser_Arafat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nelson_Mandela https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maria_Ressa https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rigoberta_Mench%C3%BA

You're mistaken about Yasser Arafat. He wasn't awarded the Nobel Peace Prize for fighting Israeli apartheid; rather, he received it for ceasing that fight in line with the Oslo Accords- a deal brokered by the United States. Here's a visual representation of why: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oslo_Accords#/media/File:Bill_...

Arafat was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize for his efforts to make peace in the middle east (as were Shimon Peres and Yitzhak Rabin), not for ceasing his political fight or for giving up his ambitions.

He said: "Peace is in our interest: as only in an atmosphere of just peace shall the Palestinian people achieve their legitimate ambition for independence and sovereignty."

Narges Mohammadi's fight is a peaceful one as well.

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#196

Post by fauigerzigerk »

imjonse wrote: post #163
dragonwriter wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> To be fair, Mandela did not get it while imprisoned and while the US and the UK were tacit supporters of the Apartheid regime. To be even more fair, Mandela wasn’t the first anti-apartheid Nobel Peace Prize award, and Albert John Lutuli (awarded 1960) and Archbishop Tutu (awarded 1984) got it for fighting apartheid when the US and UK were tacit (active, of the regime if not the apartheid policy specifically, in 196…

You are right. Although those recipients were clearly in favor of non-violent fighting for human rights and were not explicitly anti-western or anti-US (the definitions of non-recipients this subthread started with) When Dr King began opposing the Vietnam war instead of simply fighting for equal rights at home he became a larger menace.

The definition of non-recipients was never tied to violence. The examples given were Edward Snowden, Julian Assange and Chelsea Manning, all peaceful activists or journalists.

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#197

Post by bryanrasmussen »

LindeBuzoGray wrote: post #148
binarymax wrote: post #103

It would be nice if instead of everyone hating on the prize, we could take a moment and reflect. Think of what this woman and many other women trapped in these regimes are going through, the sacrifices they've made, and the bravery they show to try to make things better. Think the prize is politicized and corrupt? Whatever - it's not about you or your opinion.

> Think of what this woman and many other women trapped in these regimes are going through Iran had a parliament in 1953, when the US and UK launched operation Ajax after the prime Minister nationalized Iran's oil. The prime Minister was ousted, a dictator replaced him - who returned to Iran on a flight with Allen Dulles. The conservative mullahs were western allies in removing power from the parliament. Then this st…

I'm pretty sure there were people who cared in 1979, I wasn't one of them because I was in school. And I mean, I'm probably older than most people on HN. Probably a significant percentage of the community here didn't care in 1979 because they weren't alive.

Anyone old enough to vote in 1979 is probably pretty close to retirement now. Almost everyone in a position of power in 1979 is probably dead. Obviously Biden was a young senator, but that's about it.

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#198

Post by Paradigma11 »

wheelerof4te wrote: post #9
jansan wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the Peace Prize has been very strange of late in general. Remember when a man received the Nobel Peace Prize for not being George W. Bush?

Oh, yea, I remember. Remember when he started droning civilians all over the Middle East anyway, just because they might have been linked to Al-Qaeda? The same Al-Qaeda US supported and trained a couple decades before that.

Afaik US funding went to the afghan mujahideen not arab volunteers. Do you have evidence suggesting otherwise?

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#199

Post by tibbydudeza »

lttlrck wrote: post #128
tibbydudeza wrote: post #44

[flagged]

Conveniently ignoring the persecution of minorities. This has been going on for decades and continues to this day. E.g. the Baha’is From 2008. Just the first paragraph will do. https://news.bahai.org/story/632/ 2018. https://www.hrw.org/news/2018/10/16/iran-arrests-harassment-... 2022. The same ones imprisoned in 2008. https://www.timesofisrael.com/iran-throws-leading-bahai-acti... Tip of the iceberg.

Nobody ever claimed Iran has freedom of religion - they tolerate some as mentioned but Islamic offshoots like the Bahai, Ahmadiyya and the Alawites who claim some link to mainstream Islam and further revelations after the prophet died are definitely not tolerated.

Saudi Arabic will sentence you to death if you are deemed to be an apostate (denying Islam or converting to another religion - also no proselyting if you a Christian visiting/staying there).

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#200

Post by dragonwriter »

wheelerof4te wrote: post #9
jansan wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the Peace Prize has been very strange of late in general. Remember when a man received the Nobel Peace Prize for not being George W. Bush?

Oh, yea, I remember. Remember when he started droning civilians all over the Middle East anyway, just because they might have been linked to Al-Qaeda? The same Al-Qaeda US supported and trained a couple decades before that.

> The same Al-Qaeda US supported and trained a couple decades before that.

Al-Qaeda was formed after the Soviet withdrawal from Afghanistan, the US did not support and train al-Qaeda as such.

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