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Maybe the problem is that Harvard exists

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191–200 of 386 posts

Re: Maybe the problem is that Harvard exists

#191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And, in addition, because at least presently, anyone who didn't do Ivy+ is essentially never going to be a SCOTUS judge. For your example, you need to do a post-graduate degree (law) from the Ivy+. This article is talking about the gating functions of the undergraduate admissions departments. The graduate school admissions officers are far more likely to consider strong candidates from "normal" universities than th…

> For your example, you need to do a post-graduate degree (law) from the Ivy+. This article is talking about the gating functions of the undergraduate admissions departments. 6 of the 9 nine current justices did undergrad at Harvard, Yale or Princeton.

25% of the current Ivy+ SCOTUS judges did not go to an Ivy+ for undergrad? With additional reforms of the graduate programs would you expect that future numbers would increase or decrease?

EDIT - for some reason it will not allow me to reply to your reply...

There are 8 current judges from Ivy+ law schools and 6 of them went to Ivy+ undergrad programs. That's how I got to 25%.

I guess I question why increasing the number of judges on the Supreme Court would change the percentage of (non-Ivy+ undergrad --> Ivy+ JD) justices. I would think that the only way to do that is to increase the number of non-Ivy+ undergrads admitted to the Ivy+ JD programs.

I mean, increasing the number of balls you randomly draw from a bag of balls increases the odds of getting one of the rare balls. But increasing the proportion of rare balls in the bag such that they aren't rare anymore increases the probability more, with the added benefit for every formerly rare ball that wasn't selected for the bench.

Re: Maybe the problem is that Harvard exists

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's pretty likely Harvard has had an impact on your life in a lot of ways because a lot of people who govern you went there. And, in addition, because at least presently, anyone who didn't do Ivy+ is essentially never going to be a SCOTUS judge. The obvious objection is that given there are only 9 justices at a time, essentially nobody is ever going to be a SCOTUS judge anyway. But that misses the important gating…

> And, in addition, because at least presently, anyone who didn't do Ivy+ is essentially never going to be a SCOTUS judge. For your example, you need to do a post-graduate degree (law) from the Ivy+. This article is talking about the gating functions of the undergraduate admissions departments. The graduate school admissions officers are far more likely to consider strong candidates from "normal" universities than th…

> People shit on it constantly and call it the backdoor, not-so-honest way to get associated with Harvard.

This sounds like it's not actually going to Harvard, and you'd only get the slimy Harvard benefits by pretending you did a different program at harvard

Re: Maybe the problem is that Harvard exists

#193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given I’ve spent a long time on Wall Street that quote doesn’t quite jibe with me ;-) I’d also say it’s false for almost anyway - YouTube directly impacts most people considerably more than Wall Street shenanigans, and that I lived the plot of the big short and know what actually happened for a first hand fact, I can assure you the big short is extraordinarily short of accuracy.

Maybe this is veering off-topic, but as someone outside of that industry who understands the basic ideas around repackaging loans, etc., I’m very curious to hear which aspects you think are inaccurate!

The big short basically painted it as a naked cash grab by cackling Wall Street traders. My experience was it was fairly prosaic at the banks, essentially trying to construct products our customers wanted to buy. There was a lot of stuff that was going wrong, a lot of it was at:

At the micro level:

* local and regional banks stuffing mortgage pipelines with garbage, colluding with appraisers and others to make outrageous loans with fabricated or otherwise fraudulent docs

* loan officers effectively tricking ill equipped borrowers into unsuitable products against suitability requirements

At the macro level:

* rating agencies were ill equipped and were rating structured products AAA despite them paying junk bond returns - we tried to show them models demonstrating their ratings were too rosy but they kept us at arms length - as they should - but we felt it was really important they reassess. They wouldn’t.

* Large institutional investors seeking juiced returns but were restricted to AAA investments were eager for the junk returns, and were aware that these products were very risky despite the rating

The banks weren’t angels in this, but it’s been sold as a Wall Street issue. It was far greater than the street.

Also, “the big short” was taken on because Goldman stopped using theoretic models for valuing CDO’s and used fundamental models that showed they were extremely long subprime mortgage risk. As market makers they have risk limits on their books by internal policy and were required by their risk officers to short subprime to bring them within neutral risk with respect to their subprime mortgage exposure. It wasn’t a nefarious plot to screw the American mortgage holder - it was the bank functioning properly with proper risk management, the problem wasn’t the “big short” - it was the “big long.” Market makers are not speculators - their whole purpose is to stay neutral in the market and facilitate anyone who wants to trade long or short by quoting both sides.

Re: Maybe the problem is that Harvard exists

#194
The depth of the subject is much too great for an article. But, there's certainly some interesting discussion to be had around the relationship between people's general work outcomes and a strong gating mechanism evaluated earlier in life.

I really hope we soon see innovation around education. When the entire corpus of human knowledge became available freely - surely we would've seen changes in higher education by now (if they were/are ever going to happen).

Re: Maybe the problem is that Harvard exists

#195
post #39

This is a typical "let's be all equally poor/bad" argument. Harvard is simply a private institution with excellent reputation and not a single person is required to go there or hire someone from there. Why do Harvard people "drive 20% above the speed limit"? Because selecting good people in a sea of resumes is HARD. Degrees aren't amazing proxies for productivity, but they are decent proxies. I've seen dozens of theo…

> I've seen dozens of theories on how to interview and triage people, but few approaches beat the cost-benefit of supporting decisions based on a degree from a solid institution.

This is my exact opposite experience. Degrees are meaningless unless you've literally just left college. Even then, it tells you their scores in particular subjects, it does not tell you their attitude, work ethic, general problem solving ability, etc.

I ignore qualifications unless you've just completed it. Experience is a better guide and, I know this is controversial, just talking to the candidate - it's amazing what people will expose once they feel comfortable that they're having a friendly chat.

Re: Maybe the problem is that Harvard exists

#196
post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Recruiters and HR people are usually not subject matter experts, so they don't have the expertise to select great people from among outlier groups or from the larger population. They end up relying on indicators like top schools or top prior employers. I've hired outstanding people for dev roles with all kinds of backgrounds including self-taught, low-mid tier state schools, unfinished college, etc., but that's becau…

Yeah, this is one reason why I think the outliers at state schools are undervalued. These heuristics are indirect and lead to inefficient selection, competition over the same scarce resources. If you’re a startup there’s a strategic advantage in trying to look for talent where others aren’t and leveraging your own subject matter expertise to do so. In moneyball the scouts selected on stupid stuff rather than on base…

>Yeah, this is one reason why I think the outliers at state schools are undervalued.

What I've always heard about the big state schools is that you can get in (probably relatively easily) and then you can either spend your days doing a lot of doing sports and partying (not that there's anything wrong with that in moderation) or you can get a pretty world-class STEM degree.

Re: Maybe the problem is that Harvard exists

#197
post #39

This is a typical "let's be all equally poor/bad" argument. Harvard is simply a private institution with excellent reputation and not a single person is required to go there or hire someone from there. Why do Harvard people "drive 20% above the speed limit"? Because selecting good people in a sea of resumes is HARD. Degrees aren't amazing proxies for productivity, but they are decent proxies. I've seen dozens of theo…

> Having managed over 100+ people, I can say that on average the people from better institutions are better employees - even though I have managed amazing people without college degrees and bad people with amazing degrees. The top schools can be pretty darn great, Harvard being just one of them.

What do you recommend those of us who didn't get into any top schools do then? If clearly we're destined to be inferior for life?

Re: Maybe the problem is that Harvard exists

#198
post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> “On a personal note, I was accepted to an Ivy League school (though not Harvard) as a high school senior, but my family couldn't afford to send me there, so I had to go to a state school instead. My classmate and friend was accepted to MIT but also had to go to a state school because of money.” This does fit my hypothesis that the outliers at state schools are likely undervalued in the market by recruiters. The ave…

> the outliers at state schools are people like you with extenuating circumstances. Being middle class is an extenuating circumstance? ;-)

This word choice surprised me as well. The average Big 10 tuition for nonresidents is approaching $40,000. It is better for in-state tuition, but locking students into wherever they happened to grow up also seems unfair.

Re: Maybe the problem is that Harvard exists

#199

It has fallen out of favor but I am a massive proponent for graduated drivers licenses. Free toll roads would be silly but higher/removed speed limits seem 100% ok to me as long as it's coupled with an actual assessment of driving ability, semi-frequent required reassessment, and stiffer penalties for things such as DUI when driving in the graduated speed limit range.

Interesting idea, not sure how enforcement would work. That being said, this pretty much already happens in practice. Many people go their whole lives driving (safely) over the speed limit without ever getting a ticket, because they aren't being reckless about it.

Generally police officers will ignore you if you're just going with the flow or slightly faster. It's when you start going a lot faster or weaving or being otherwise reckless that they start to care.

Re: Maybe the problem is that Harvard exists

#200
post #5

Every tech company I’ve worked at has been run by Ivy people but all the actual code is written by Cal State graduates and high school dropouts.

This is not true of any FAANG and I've worked for all of them. Go to any of them and you will see that most of the SWEs are some combination of MIT, Cal, Stanford, and tier-1 public schools and top 20 (by US News Report) private schools.

I worked at Amazon and I didn't meet a single person in the L4-L6 engineering set that went to an Ivy or other top school (except for one or two that went to CMU). The rest went to state schools including myself.

Now I'm at a somewhat well regarded startup and most of the people around me went to Cal States, Arizona State, or UC's.

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