Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

mainichi.jp

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

191–200 of 264 posts

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#191

Post by blululu »

epolanski wrote: post #175
drumhead wrote: post #12

Taking a small local car manufacturer and turning it into the one of the worlds biggest car makers, , overtaking all the US giants and creating the JIT process to revolutionise manufacturing is remarkable.

Toyota isn't just "one of the worlds biggest car makers" it is THE biggest car maker on the planet. They sell 25% more cars than the Volkswagen group (second biggest car maker on the planet) which includes Volkswagen, SEAT, Skoda, Porsche, Bentley and Audi and 50% more than Stellantins (which includes Fiat, Citroen, Peaugeot, Jeep, Ram, Alfa Romeo, Chrysler, Opel and another 6 manufacturers). It's just impressive how…

It's even better than that: I am not a recurrent customer since my 2004 Corolla is still rolling along after all these years. Who knows maybe I'll buy another one someday, but it hasn't been an urgent priority.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#192

Post by Forgeties79 »

rawgabbit wrote: post #161
Forgeties79 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am curious how many people are rethinking how aggressively to set up a JIT system in the wake of COVID and the supply chain issues, given it clearly cost many companies an astronomical amount of money in the end. Obviously you shouldn't build your entire company around rare, worst case scenarios, but there should probably be some consideration budgeted in for them IMO and it seems few companies were ready for rainy…

JIT made sense for Toyota and they took steps to ensure their suppliers were beholden to them (that is they shipped whenever Toyota needed it). JIT doesn't make sense for global supply chains when the suppliers i.e. China or Russia government can impose embargoes at will with little warning.

> JIT made sense for Toyota and they took steps to ensure their suppliers were beholden to them (that is they shipped whenever Toyota needed it).

Did that still hold true during the pandemic? I mean if you can't get stuff on the ships (huge part of the chain) they can't go out. It's not always a choice for suppliers as we saw.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#193

Post by astrange »

Gordonjcp wrote: post #107
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe so. He is almost revered, in Japan. I'm told he was laughed out of the US, which is why he set up shop in Japan.

Now you imagine, how good do your ideas have to be an American coming to Japan just after World War II, and all the industry leaders of somewhere that was famously insular go "yeah, actually, this is good, this is what we should do, let's get this guy to meet everyone"?

A strange variant of this is Japan's reaction to getting anti-Semitic propaganda from Europe was that these people secretly controlling the world sounded pretty cool and competent, so they tried getting them to immigrate. Though, it didn't really work out.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#194

Post by julianz »

edmundsauto wrote: post #132
oblio wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I learned about him only recently and despite his supposedly strong influence, he isn't talked about much.

Fwiw, I hear about Deming so often that my bias is that he’s over represented! Then again, my dad was in the field so he was practically revered in my childhood.

Yep, same. My dad introduced "total quality management" into New Zealand and I heard about Deming a hell of a lot growing up.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#195

Post by astrange »

ericalexander0 wrote: post #14
gkanai wrote: post #2

I've seen this news of Toyoda's passing posted across various social media channels and it's incredible to see how many Toyota owners have thanked him posthumously. I remember that when Steve Jobs died. This seems similar in a sense.

It's no coincidence. Jobs was influenced by quality philosophers like Toyoda, Deming, etc. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kib6uXQsxBA

You could say Apple is basically an American copy of Sony. That's why he wore a uniform even if he couldn't get anyone else to do it.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#196

Post by ethbr0 »

redwall_hp wrote: post #157
Aperocky wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> everyone is important and valued This statement is in seeming conflict well documented hierarchical nature of Japanese society.

That's a very western lens still. Hierarchy doesn't mean you view those under you with contempt. The entire concept of a team, on a micro scale, is that it has a leader who is invested in the group's success and people who choose to follow them because they think the leader respects them and can provide the necessary coordination. Toxic individualism doesn't get things done, nor does it encourage excellence. A hierar…

I think this was the needle Kant was trying to thread with the categorical imperative.

Hierarchies are efficient and necessary, but ethically dubious and subject to abuse. Ergo, a hierarchy where everyone acts as though their position in it may be randomly swapped at any time is the optimal configuration.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#197

Post by rr808 »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #73
rr808 wrote: post #31

Lots of people saying Toyota missed the boat on EVs. I'm not convinced the technology, infrastructure or battery supply is ready for true mass production of EVs. Toyota makes 10 million cars a year, they'll be selling good EVs soon enough to put Tesla to shame.

The thing is that if Toyota wants to be a leader in this space, they should not wait for this to happen but be making it happen. The reality is that they have not been doing that. And others have. If they wanted to be a leader in this space, five years ago would have been late to start putting in place the strategy, infrastructure, supply chains, etc. you need to build EVs. They did not do much five years ago other t…

Toyota has a lot of PHEVs now. The RAV4 Prime is awesome if you can get one. It isn't very difficult to change a PHEV to an BEV.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#198

Post by quartesixte »

rawgabbit wrote: post #161
Forgeties79 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am curious how many people are rethinking how aggressively to set up a JIT system in the wake of COVID and the supply chain issues, given it clearly cost many companies an astronomical amount of money in the end. Obviously you shouldn't build your entire company around rare, worst case scenarios, but there should probably be some consideration budgeted in for them IMO and it seems few companies were ready for rainy…

JIT made sense for Toyota and they took steps to ensure their suppliers were beholden to them (that is they shipped whenever Toyota needed it). JIT doesn't make sense for global supply chains when the suppliers i.e. China or Russia government can impose embargoes at will with little warning.

JIT also works really well when all your major manufacturing centers are an average 3-4 hour drive from each other. 6-8 at the furthest maybe.

JIT breaks down over global distances because “in time” and “instant” mean very different things even when moving nearly at the speed of sound. Even if no one embargoed anyone, you can’t beat the laws of physics.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#199

Post by bobthepanda »

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #148
Gordonjcp wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now you imagine, how good do your ideas have to be an American coming to Japan just after World War II, and all the industry leaders of somewhere that was famously insular go "yeah, actually, this is good, this is what we should do, let's get this guy to meet everyone"?

>yeah, actually, this is good, this is what we should do, let's get this guy to meet everyone" Or they go "they won, I guess we're obligated to try doing it their way at least once".

Japan’s destruction was extremely total; even if you did not get hit by the nukes, your city was most likely firebombed to the ground. The economy was in shambles, everyone who was still alive was struggling to eat as the logistics chain had totally broken down, etc.

In that context it is not really surprising that Japan rejected many of its old institutions and ways.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#200

Post by sangnoir »

clouddrover wrote: post #40
rr808 wrote: post #31

Lots of people saying Toyota missed the boat on EVs. I'm not convinced the technology, infrastructure or battery supply is ready for true mass production of EVs. Toyota makes 10 million cars a year, they'll be selling good EVs soon enough to put Tesla to shame.

Volkswagen makes 10 million cars a year and they're pushing hard for EVs now. The main difference between Volkswagen's and Toyota's situation is that Toyota is still in a good position to meet fleet emissions requirements globally because they've been selling hybrids for so long. But Volkswagen needs to pump out EVs now to meet their fleet emissions targets. Fleet emissions fines are simply dead money. You're much be…

> Volkswagen makes 10 million cars a year and they're pushing hard for EVs now.

That decision was made under duress[1]. Thanks, Dieselgate!

1. The money VW Group was fined for Dieselgate in the US was directed to fund the "Electrify America" charging network. It would have been braindead for VW to give competition a leg-up by not electrify after paying for the infrastructure: the punishment was very well thought-out.

Post reply on HN