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US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

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Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#191

Post by avalys »

0xbadcafebee wrote: post #86
TheAdamist wrote: post #73

Cheap balloon vs expensive missile, seems a good way to bankrupt us by sending continuous balloons.

A government that spends more money on their military than the rest of the world combined isn't at risk of bankruptcy from firing a couple missiles. We're at risk of bankruptcy because our debt is 31 trillion dollars and in June we won't even be able to issue securities to continue bullshitting ourselves out of cutting spending. Welcome to America, we're broke because we spent all our money on guns rather than infras…

> Welcome to America, we're broke because we spent all our money on guns rather than infrastructure, healthcare and education.

This sentiment is completely untrue. Defense is approximately 12% of US government spending, healthcare approximately 24%, education approximately 15%, and social security roughly 20%. Infrastructure is harder to categorize, but the truth is that the US government spends at least 4x more on healthcare, education and welfare (combined) than defense.

https://www.usgovernmentspending.com/year_spending_2023USrn_...

The fact that this 12% of government spending amounts to the largest military on earth is in large part a consequence of the fact that the US is really, enormously wealthy compared to most of the rest of the world, has a fairly large population, and still has a larger GDP per capita than any other large or even medium-sized country.

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#192

Post by msandford »

Eduard wrote: post #138
durandal1 wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At those altitudes the combination of a very high closing speed (air is thin) and the short range of the gun creates a real risk of flying into the target you're trying to hit.

This sounds paradoxical to me. Using the same reasoning, a gun bullet should also be faster with higher altitude, hence have a longer range.

It's not that the bullets won't fly a long ways. It's that the range where the gun is accurate is fairly small. Sure you could theoretically shoot it from 20 miles away as long as you're 15 miles above the target and can successfully plot the ballistic arc, windage, etc. But fighter jets aren't flying artillery pieces so their computers don't do that kind of targeting.

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#193

Post by mrguyorama »

jnurmine wrote: post #123
jollyllama wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So it doesn't really narrow it down that much, then. Could be a plane, could be a balloon.

If it was not a drone, and "not a balloon", what could it be? Assuming this was a drone, the "car-sized", "unmanned", "not a balloon", "not maneuverable" (!?), the operating altitude (40k feet / 13 km), and use of AIM9X (IR/heat seeking) should narrow down the possible drones. Also, one thing I pondered: why F22 instead of F35 to shoot it down? Maybe a question of availability. But, at least publically the F35 operat…

The F22 is America's superiority fighter, still beating the F35 in stealth and capability for anti flying things action. The F22 will probably be the default in most intercept circumstances.

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#194

Post by Waterluvian »

1970-01-01 wrote: post #20

We need a cheaper way to down these spy balloons. The sidewinder missile + F-22 flight time costs are an order of magnitude greater than the total cost of launching one balloon. Send over the High Energy Laser with Integrated Optical-dazzler (HELIOS) to protect the west coast.

Don’t necessarily disagree and I don’t know sufficient details to form a responsible opinion, but I imagine there’s expenditure for training, whether they hit actual stuff or not?

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#195

Post by death_to_satan »

mancerayder wrote: post #16

Spying happens all the time, even between allies. From what I read/understood about past spying incidents, it's only when someone starts mentioning it to the press that they want the rest of the population to be up an arms about it. Why that might be true: there are probably tons of Chinese spy events (and American spy events on China) that never made it. Was the balloon the first? Come on. If the above hypothesis is…

[dead]

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#196

Post by Animats »

jnurmine wrote: post #123
jollyllama wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So it doesn't really narrow it down that much, then. Could be a plane, could be a balloon.

If it was not a drone, and "not a balloon", what could it be? Assuming this was a drone, the "car-sized", "unmanned", "not a balloon", "not maneuverable" (!?), the operating altitude (40k feet / 13 km), and use of AIM9X (IR/heat seeking) should narrow down the possible drones. Also, one thing I pondered: why F22 instead of F35 to shoot it down? Maybe a question of availability. But, at least publically the F35 operat…

> If it was not a drone, and "not a balloon", what could it be?

It could be an unmanned glider with some solar power. Several companies make those. Including Google, which was considering them as data relays back around 2016.

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#197

Post by sschueller »

kazmerb wrote: post #186
sschueller wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see much difference between Chinese routers having back-doors and what Cisco has peddled to its customers all these years either willfully or just incompetence.

I'd rather my own government spy on me than China. I'd rather Hannibal fucking Lecter be able to see me through my webcam than China.

I would too but Europe sold all its companies to the US and China.

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#198

Post by UncleOxidant »

api wrote: post #59

So what’s the deal with these balloons? Provocation? Do they think nobody will notice?

It's not like this is new. We know there were 3 during the T administration. Now for some reason we've decided we need to be paranoid about them.

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#199

Post by nsxwolf »

1970-01-01 wrote: post #20

We need a cheaper way to down these spy balloons. The sidewinder missile + F-22 flight time costs are an order of magnitude greater than the total cost of launching one balloon. Send over the High Energy Laser with Integrated Optical-dazzler (HELIOS) to protect the west coast.

For some number of balloons N, the operational experience our fighter pilots get is priceless.
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