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Stop developing this technology

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Re: Stop developing this technology

#191

Post by sneak »

pavlov wrote: post #87
sneak wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing about producing or consuming deepfakes suggests bad faith. You might not like the art, but deepfakes are not harmful.

“NSFW deepfakes” literally means “porn with real people’s faces inserted.” Maybe that’s an art form, but it’s also clearly potentially harmful in the same way as revenge porn, teenage nude selfies, and other cases where regular people and porn intersect.

Why is it clearly potentially harmful? It is not clear to me at all, as photoshop already exists.

How is someone harmed by someone else producing video that features people who look like them? The whole "seeing is believing" thing hasn't been true for ages, every movie is half CG these days.

I would perhaps buy the premise if deepfakes were sprung on the scene in the 70s or 80s, but the 90s and 2000s have inundated so many with completely fantastical high res CG imagery that nobody thinks videos are proof of anything anymore.

Re: Stop developing this technology

#193

Post by jmnicolas »

You can't stop these kinds of double edge swords from being developed but what I'd like is for people to get together and dev a counter to that, something like DetectDeepFace.

For me everything (image, text, sound etc) that comes from a computer is suspect nowadays.

Re: Stop developing this technology

#194

Post by sneak »

d0gsg0w00f wrote: post #168
sneak wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fake information being promoted does not inherently spread chaos. The church has been around for years and despite the millennia of lies we are all still here and thriving and improving. Bullshit spreads faster, but truth wins out over centuries because it doesn't go away when you stop looking at it.

The church has been around for years and despite the millennia of lies we are all still here and thriving and improving. Sure, certain members of the church got carried away with their power but the church has also been a huge psychological boon to billions of people. For example, we have Christianity to thank for the concept of individual rights and sovereignty. It wasn't that long ago that individuals did not have…

I'm not referring to "certain members", I am talking about the big lie that is central to the church, espoused by every member.

Somehow even with that, vested in authority, we have managed to move past it as a species and have progressed beyond superstitions.

Spreading misinformation is a self-correcting problem. It simply goes away when people get bored with the meme. Reality and truth does not.

Re: Stop developing this technology

#195

Post by thedorkknight »

wruza wrote: post #84

if someone blame this technology, why not to blame guns, warships, tanks, airplanes, shotguns, machineguns before blaming this technology? We actually blame them, except for airplanes. Most of these were invented at the times when lives had much less value and are of no use unless some half-minded pig attacks you or tries to undermine your defenses. I’d like to see how this line of reasoning changes when someone rele…

I'll give them props for using an example that is at least challenging to think of positive uses for. The comments snarkily advocating banning electricity or penises just make me wonder what the users' reading comprehension skills are, given that the initial comment is pretty clear on the problem being that they don't think deepfakes have ANY positive use

Re: Stop developing this technology

#196

Post by josephg »

proto-n wrote: post #178

Here's what I would have answered to the OP in the link: This technology is going to be developed regardless of what we do here. Please realize that you are not advocating for it not to be developed: rather, you are advocating for it not to be developed in the open .

Scammers don't have an unlimited amount of money and skill. Frankly, if the people working at scammer call centers had the skill to make something like this, they probably wouldn't want to work in a scamming call center.

Let this technology be made by someone else. Let it be made by governments and whoever in secret. We know its possible; but just because its possible doesn't mean you have to be the person who does it. If we can delay scammers using this stuff for a few years, we'll keep millions of people from being scammed in the intervening time. Thats a win in my book.

Re: Stop developing this technology

#197

Post by noAnswer »

bondarchuk wrote: post #180
noAnswer wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Joseph Weizenbaum once said to the question (paraphrasing) "If I don't develop evil/unethical thing Z, someone else will." with: "In city X every day there is rape and if I don't do it, someone else will." Showing how stupid this line of reasoning is.

But that's stupid, if he does it there is MORE rape.

So not only will someone else do it, if you join, there will be even more harm. So don't do it!

Re: Stop developing this technology

#198

Post by jehb »

rbanffy wrote: post #119
pjc50 wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We've not had the test case, but in places where nonconsensual or "revenge" porn is criminalized, deepfakes may well turn out to be illegal. They're certainly distressing for the victim.

It's already illegal for a person to pretend to be another real person without their consent.

This needs an asterisk (and I'll include one of my own: IANAL). In the United States, impersonation is regulated by the states and not consistent across them, but in general this is only true when using impersonation to commit fraud, defamation, or another act that itself is likely a crime already. Many cases would be considered parody or satire, even if no one finds them funny.

Re: Stop developing this technology

#199

Post by Jemm »

jakelazaroff wrote: post #3

Regardless of what I think about this technology in particular, I want to respond to this line from the second comment: [1] > on the contrary, it must be developed. No, it mustn’t. There’s not a gun to your head, forcing you to do this. You want to develop this technology. That’s why it’s happening. Technology isn’t inevitable. It’s a choice we make. And we can go in circles about whether it’s good or bad, but at lea…

I disagree. We should develop this technology and make people aware of the implications and teach them to be vigilant.

Re: Stop developing this technology

#200

Post by harimau777 »

sneak wrote: post #191
pavlov wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“NSFW deepfakes” literally means “porn with real people’s faces inserted.” Maybe that’s an art form, but it’s also clearly potentially harmful in the same way as revenge porn, teenage nude selfies, and other cases where regular people and porn intersect.

Why is it clearly potentially harmful? It is not clear to me at all, as photoshop already exists. How is someone harmed by someone else producing video that features people who look like them? The whole "seeing is believing" thing hasn't been true for ages, every movie is half CG these days. I would perhaps buy the premise if deepfakes were sprung on the scene in the 70s or 80s, but the 90s and 2000s have inundated s…

Wouldn't there be a dramatically different level of effort to photoshop every frame in a video convincingly than to create a deep fake of the video?
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