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WordPress has left the building

kevinjohngallagher.com

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Re: WordPress has left the building

#191

Post by sandGorgon »

saltcod wrote: post #22

After about 10 minutes with Plone, a few months with Joomla, about 2 years with Drupal, and finally 3 years with WordPress, I think WordPress is still a brilliant solution for lots of problems. The closest competitor, Drupal, is an absolute nightmare. For designers, developers and certainly for the end user. It still doesn't even ship with a wysiwyg editor—hard to disagree that this is precisely what the end user wan…

Drupal actually has a different paradigm than what most other CMSes atleast pretend at - PAC (http://www.garfieldtech.com/blog/mvc-vs-pac)

The fact that modules break, etc. imho is a Good Thing - in following the rule of "failing fast". Since, you dont need to change/hack the drupal core to do anything complex, if a module is breaking it is typically highlighting incompatibilities with other modules (99.99% of the time). Giving a white screen on module install is exactly the right time to have it happen, rather than 1 month later, when it goes live.

I completely agree with you on the admin UI part - I had just two main peeves with Drupal 6: Postgres support, which got fixed in Drupal 7 and admin UI, which is not yet done. I also wish that they provide a couple of starter "installation profiles" - blog, wiki, corporate, etc. - enabling a quick start for 99% of the population.

Re: WordPress has left the building

#192

Post by nikcub »

can someone please clarify what you mean by these points?

* document management (I assume more like an enterprise CMS)

* link management (outbound links on posts? detect 404s?)

* publishing options

* 'application'

Re: WordPress has left the building

#193

Post by dextorious »

saltcod wrote: post #22

After about 10 minutes with Plone, a few months with Joomla, about 2 years with Drupal, and finally 3 years with WordPress, I think WordPress is still a brilliant solution for lots of problems. The closest competitor, Drupal, is an absolute nightmare. For designers, developers and certainly for the end user. It still doesn't even ship with a wysiwyg editor—hard to disagree that this is precisely what the end user wan…

"""After about 10 minutes with Plone, a few months with Joomla, about 2 years with Drupal, and finally 3 years with WordPress, I think WordPress is still a brilliant solution for lots of problems."""

I agree. And I think this says a lot of the sorry state of Open Source (actually, even proprietary) CMS engines.

Wordpress is kinda nice, but it too breaks down.

For sites after a certain level of complexity, instead of CMS like Drupal etc, what would be useful would be a CMS lib, to build your own solution around.

Don't have my work in your idiotic constraints, just give me something like (fake language):

front_page_articles = get("type"=>"article", "limit"=>5, "published"=>true, "order"=>"DESC");

search_results = search("query"=>$query, "limit"=>100, "order"=>"RELEVANCE", "range"=>[10,20]);

add_document("body"=>$body, "title"=>$title, "createdBy"=>getCurrentUser().id. ...);

The thing that Apache Jackrabbit could be, but isn't exactly/yet.

Re: WordPress has left the building

#194

Post by dextorious »

FraaJad wrote: post #20

Time and again, people want to use a hacked up blogging engine as a CMS and lament that it is not working. Use a CMS that's been around for more than decade which has all the features you want in a proper CMS (single sign on, WYSIWGY, multi-lingual support, a huge community of developers and service providers). ie., Plone -- http://plone.org

I also want it to be easily adjustable to arbitrary needs. This doesn't cut it.

Also, Zope based. I worked with Zope building large portals from 2000-2004. Worked, but not a very pleasant experience.

Re: WordPress has left the building

#195

Post by dextorious »

alwillis wrote: post #129

I guess someone should tell TechCrunch, BoingBoing, GigaOM and the rest of the large sites on WordPress to stop using WordPress, because it's not a CMS, or so we're being told. What people don't seem to get that WordPress has been morphing from "just" a blogging platform to a CMS ever since 3.0 shipped. It'll just be a matter of time before most of the legacy stuff is gone and we'll have a CMS that can do blogging in…

"X is not Y"

"Please someone inform Z (people/companies that abuse X as Y or even use it as KDoesn't look that smart this way, now, does it?

Re: WordPress has left the building

#196

Post by dextorious »

rvkennedy wrote: post #30

In the OP: they dont have a Tester. They just load it on their MacBooks and presume it works for the other 95% of the world Really, wordpress.org users are the testers, wordpress.com users are the customers. I'd love to hear what the OP now recommends though, that would provide some good perspective.

Really? You have to ask?

Tons of free software projects have ESTABLISHED testing procedures. Have some of your developers/project members sit and check it is OK before shipping it.

Even more so, if you have a huge company and PAID developers on the project (Automatic).

Re: WordPress has left the building

#197

Post by semuelf »

How about the old competitor: Movable Type?

  - Document management: have revision system
  - Workflow management: each entry can be draft, published, or scheduled 
  - Digital asset management: included
  - Link management: no
  - User management: powerful
  - ESI Caching / CDN ability: no
  - WYSIWYG editing: exists
  - Single Sign-on: of course
  - Multi-side Admin: of course
  - Publishing options: static, dynamic and more
  - Access Management: of course
  - Application - ?
  - Multi-lingual: English, Japanese, France, Spanish and German. (IIRC)
Disclaimer: I'm in the core team

Edit: reply point-by-point

Re: WordPress has left the building

#198

Post by whatusername »

paul9290 wrote: post #87

What is a better CMS solution? I have client who is asking me to build a WordPress CMS, but after reading this I'd like to hear what the better and easier (to implement & use) alternatives are.

Does your client have a large team of people who will be editing this CMS? Things like workflow management are essential if you're running sites like: http://technet.microsoft.com or http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/

Not so much the website/blog of a startup of 10 people. For that kind of use-case -- Wordpress is awesome.

Re: WordPress has left the building

#199

Post by ahmadss »

ahmadss wrote: post #109
mortenjorck wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the author's problem, and the problem of nearly every frustrated WordPress user, is that the alternatives aren't nearly as enjoyable to work with as WordPress. It has a nice, understandable, and flexible API, and even though its greatest strengths are really only in blogging, the friendliness of the environment naturally invites stretching its use. For these people, I would strongly recommend a look at Proces…

An alternative that is not as well known is ExpressionEngine. FWIW, we've done a slew of EE installs and a few WordPress intalls and clients that have made the switch from EE to WP have loved it. The admin UI is attractive for end users, and when it comes to theming, designers love the flexibility of the layout variations and front-end developers can actually implement said designs without hacking the EE theming syst…

Sorry for the confusion - I meant to say "from WordPress to ExpressionEngine" on the first line... I don't know how to edit a post, so I'm just replying here.

Re: WordPress has left the building

#200

Post by joelhaus »

jacques_chester wrote: post #142
kevinjohn wrote: post #125

Hello everyone, I'm Kevinjohn Gallagher, the author of the post. While I really appreciate all the comments, quite a few folks here have made presumptions that are really wide of the mark. I love WordPress. I use it for my personal site, and thats not going to change. WordPress is very good at what it does, and Im in no way down on it for that; its just that the needs of my small company is now very different that th…

> So much of the change involved in the WordPress product is horribly unmanaged. As the volunteer admin of a small blog network, I cannot agree more. Having to upgrade whole versions just to get a security fix is terrible practice, but I'm forced to do it.

Agreed, my highly customized installs are occasionally broken by the upgrades, so I was really happy find this plugin: http://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/hotfix/

However, it's often a band-aid that isn't big enough for the wound.

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