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Unicode character “ꙮ” (U+A66E) is being updated

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Re: Unicode character “ꙮ” (U+A66E) is being updated

#191

Post by kadoban »

yakireev wrote: post #130
eternityforest wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that doesn't change the fact that most people use them snd like them, and there is not much technical disruption. They just chose practicality over purity.

Most people (me included) like funny cat videos and send funny cat videos. Shall we include some to Unicode? I mean, this ship has long sailed, but that was a mistake nevertheless. Not everything has to be a unicode character.

If there were specific funny cat videos that were culturally relevent, maybe.

For example I could see there being an emoji for keyboard cat.

Re: Unicode character “ꙮ” (U+A66E) is being updated

#192

Post by caf »

School-Cotton wrote: post #184
colejohnson66 wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unicode's mission is to make every document "roundtrip-able". Even if a character is only used once, it should be possible to save a plaintext version of the containing document without losing any information. Roughly, I should be able to put a transcription of that one translation from the 1400s on Wikisource without using images. You may disagree with me, and that's fine, but it doesn't change Unicode's mission. Be…

The artist Prince changed his stage name to an unpronounceable symbol for a few years. It appears in more than one document. Should it be added to Unicode?

Probably. Maybe you can propose it.

Re: Unicode character “ꙮ” (U+A66E) is being updated

#194

Post by personjerry »

If you open the proposal [0] it kinda just looks like someone doodled some flowers on the text rather than actually used a particular letter. And given it's the ONLY existing record of this letter, it's very suspect isn't it?

[0]: https://www.unicode.org/wg2/docs/n5170-multiocular-o.pdf

Re: Unicode character “ꙮ” (U+A66E) is being updated

#195

Post by kadoban »

vcxy wrote: post #146
kadoban wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For as inclusive as that mission is, it seems weird to me how limited in certain areas unicode is. For instance, people use peach emoji since there isn't one for butt, eggplant since there's no penis, etc. This doesn't contradict the stated goal exactly, but it seems against the spirit of it at least.

I tried to reply with just a unicode penis but that got flagged immediately, so I'll be more substantial and leave out the actual penis. It appears in Egyptian hieroglyphs, so actually there is a penis included in unicode.

That's true, good call. I feel like there should be one without the context of Egyptian hieroglphys though, though I'm not exactly sure how that kind of thing works in unicode.

Re: Unicode character “ꙮ” (U+A66E) is being updated

#196

Post by Gare »

personjerry wrote: post #194

If you open the proposal [0] it kinda just looks like someone doodled some flowers on the text rather than actually used a particular letter. And given it's the ONLY existing record of this letter, it's very suspect isn't it? [0]: https://www.unicode.org/wg2/docs/n5170-multiocular-o.pdf

It's in place of "goo" in "mnogoočimi" (many-eyed) in the phrase "many-eyed seraphims", so it at least makes sense.

Re: Unicode character “ꙮ” (U+A66E) is being updated

#197

Post by lifthrasiir »

lmm wrote: post #158
colejohnson66 wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unicode's mission is to make every document "roundtrip-able". Even if a character is only used once, it should be possible to save a plaintext version of the containing document without losing any information. Roughly, I should be able to put a transcription of that one translation from the 1400s on Wikisource without using images. You may disagree with me, and that's fine, but it doesn't change Unicode's mission. Be…

Meanwhile one still can't roundtrip regular Japanese without some kind of funky out-of-band signalling. By itself this kind of thing is harmless, but it speaks to poor prioritization from Unicode.

This is incorrect. I think you defined round-trip as something else, but some character set A providing a round-trip compatibility with other set B means that B can be converted to A and back to B without a loss. And it is one of Unicode's explicit goals to provide a round-trip compatibility with major encodings including Japanese ones.

Han unification only means that when you convert Japanese encodings (B) to Unicode (A), it is not distinguishable from non-Japanese encodings converted to Unicode. This means that the Unicode text doesn't always follow domestic conventions without out-of-band signaling or IVD or so. But if you know that the text was converted from a particular encoding, you can perfectly recover the original text encoded in that encoding.

Re: Unicode character “ꙮ” (U+A66E) is being updated

#198

Post by caf »

lmkg wrote: post #9
kratom_sandwich wrote: post #2

I love this character and I love the fact that is being updated. Just to get this right: at some point some person chose to doodle the letter instead of writing it the correct way and now we have a corresponding Unicode character? Sort of amazing and it also makes you think ...

There was a... "tradition" is a strong word, perhaps "trend" is better. Authors making copies of the Bible or related works in Cyrillic, that the letter O (equivalent to Roman O) at the beginning of the word for "eye" would be stylized to look like an eye. There are a variety of glyphs along these lines: Ꙩ, Ꙫ, Ꙭ. All of them, including ꙮ, were added to Unicode as a single group. The glyph "ꙮ" was used to refer to an…

"meme"

Re: Unicode character “ꙮ” (U+A66E) is being updated

#200

Post by caf »

baltimore wrote: post #56

Is there any end to this? E.g., why not include Galileo's pictograms of Saturn as seen here: https://www.edwardtufte.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=...

Galileo's pictograms aren't being used as a letter, though: they're explicitly a diagram (I believe he says "like this: ").
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