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Tell HN: Upwork has an impersonation problem

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Re: Tell HN: Upwork has an impersonation problem

#191

Post by prepend »

ActionHank wrote: post #187
streetcat1 wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you do not mind committing a fraud. Not sure how this is different from any other crime.

It’s only fraud if you sign a contract that states their job is your only form of employment and that you are working 8 hrs a day for them.

Almost every job I’ve taken stated it was a full time position. Full time in the US means 32+ hours. They also had posted core business hours we were required to work. My current org has core hours of 7am-530pm that we must work 8 hours within.

So I think it’s pretty common.

Re: Tell HN: Upwork has an impersonation problem

#192

Post by mgkimsal »

smt88 wrote: post #49
mgkimsal wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's such a cesspool of fraud now that I can't figure out how to find the honest people. now ? I've heard similar horror stories going back years. Perhaps you were lucky in that you got more positive than negative out of it earlier?

It's very possible I was lucky. I also only worked with people who were willing to appear on video, had long work history, and didn't do more than a single job at a time. Recently I had thought that maybe prices had gone up, and I was just not paying enough for the honest, individual contractors, but even at $120+/hr, we were getting people misrepresenting their skills or trying to trick us with subcontractors.

The few success stories I've known from upwork have been people who managed to find one sharp person, then went direct with them ASAP, and left upwork behind.

Re: Tell HN: Upwork has an impersonation problem

#193

Post by prepend »

zizee wrote: post #109
mgkimsal wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

20 years ago, someone stole my credit card information and bought some stuff as me. I'm in Michigan, and they sent a bed and mattress to Florida. I called the store first, asking about the charge. Verified some part of the card number, name the order was under, etc... I asked what address it was sent to. "We can't tell you that. Our privacy policy prevents that". Me: "So... you're charging what is my credit card, you…

To be fair to the store, their privacy policy was likely designed to stop things like abusive spouses/parents tracking down people who they gave permission to use a card.

To be unfair to the store, they are probably just being stupid.

Not giving the shipping address to the “customer” is just dumb. I think it’s good to protect people from abusive spouses and parents, but if someone is using their credit card and impersonating them then that’s not quite right.

I also think it’s more likely to have identity theft than to have a spouse trying to find the new address where a mattress was sent.

My theory is that the store was trying to protect their sale and was gambling that with less info the real person would not be able to cancel the order. So short sightedness.

Re: Tell HN: Upwork has an impersonation problem

#194

Post by mgkimsal »

prepend wrote: post #193
zizee wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair to the store, their privacy policy was likely designed to stop things like abusive spouses/parents tracking down people who they gave permission to use a card.

To be unfair to the store, they are probably just being stupid. Not giving the shipping address to the “customer” is just dumb. I think it’s good to protect people from abusive spouses and parents, but if someone is using their credit card and impersonating them then that’s not quite right. I also think it’s more likely to have identity theft than to have a spouse trying to find the new address where a mattress was s…

well... I ended up 'cancelling' via chargeback anyway.

Re: Tell HN: Upwork has an impersonation problem

#195

Post by birdyrooster »

rjbwork wrote: post #152
ryandrake wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP's getting dunked on but he has a point: There are no consequences anymore for wrongdoing, unless it's one of a few very specific (often mortally violent) wrongdoings. So, the wrongdoers get a major advantage with no risk. To be honest, sometimes I feel like a sucker for not taking advantage. The whole spectrum from "criminal" to "mere asshole" goes unpunished. I could walk into a store in San Francisco today, righ…

>It's like society hardly even functions anymore. Because it doesn't. We aren't meant to live like we live. We're hyper-individualized, alienated, and atomized by our relations to the means of production. We're all mercenary wage slaves just trying to get enough scratch to escape the rat race for a few years before we kick the bucket. Nearly all of those that don't really have this concern (aka the already-set-for-li…

Iceland is the way

Re: Tell HN: Upwork has an impersonation problem

#196

Post by birdyrooster »

birdyrooster wrote: post #159
throwawaysleep wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they had a problem with me, I am sure that my performance would be complained about by now.

You are abusing the good faith that managers employ to help people going through tough times without requiring explicit explanation.

Furthermore, what you are creating is a situation where people who are having a tough time at work will no longer get the benefit of the doubt because abusers like yourself will have poisoned the well.

Re: Tell HN: Upwork has an impersonation problem

#197

Post by ActionHank »

markdown wrote: post #93

> As engineers we really have no recourse. Upwork takes a commission, so they are benefitting financially from this fraud. You absolutely have recourse.

Upwork is relying on the fact that all parties involved likely don't have the funds or care enough to pursue them legally. Given that they can define what options are available as far as recourse.

Re: Tell HN: Upwork has an impersonation problem

#198

Post by throwawaysleep »

prepend wrote: post #191
ActionHank wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s only fraud if you sign a contract that states their job is your only form of employment and that you are working 8 hrs a day for them.

Almost every job I’ve taken stated it was a full time position. Full time in the US means 32+ hours. They also had posted core business hours we were required to work. My current org has core hours of 7am-530pm that we must work 8 hours within. So I think it’s pretty common.

My contracts have that. My contracts also lay out the consequences for not following through, which are merely being terminated. It is like parking fines. As long as you are willing to pay $40, park anywhere you want.

Re: Tell HN: Upwork has an impersonation problem

#199

Post by throwawaysleep »

svnpenn wrote: post #71
throwawaysleep wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

> Honest people with more skill are trying to get basic entry level jobs This is me. Can you please help? srpen6@gmail.com

Literally just make stuff up on your resume and use defunct companies so it is hard to prove that you worked there.

Re: Tell HN: Upwork has an impersonation problem

#200

Post by DiggyJohnson »

eyelidlessness wrote: post #174
DiggyJohnson wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, I relate: but would you comply if asked for webcam on for an interview for a remote position?

Quoting myself: I very seldom feel inclined to refuse . That said, interviewing for my current position (fully remote team), I was given the option of video or voice call, and I chose voice. I chose that cautiously because I knew it might be offputting but I also knew it might be a good indicator of my prospective team’s culture if it had been offputting. Fortunately that wasn’t an issue! And I now do a video chat ab…

I would have chosen video chat, but otherwise it sounds likes we have a very similar perspective on this. Good point about using that moment as a team fit thing. Cheers
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