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Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

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Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#191

Post by epicureanideal »

pedrosorio wrote: post #165
skinkestek wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been contacted by a FAANG (or is it MANGA?) company too recently, one of the traditionally better ones. Earlier I'd fallen ober myself for that but I ended up not following through. I love my current. I'm hesitant to work in a place where I can get thrown under the bus for being a man. I'm not sure I want to contribute to the surveillance economy etc. Maybe another day I'll answer yes, but...

> I'm hesitant to work in a place where I can get thrown under the bus for being a man This is not a thing.

Actually it is. I’ve seen it.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#192

Post by epicureanideal »

skinkestek wrote: post #170
pedrosorio wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm hesitant to work in a place where I can get thrown under the bus for being a man This is not a thing.

ok, good to know. But it still doesn't feel safe.

There are varying degrees of discrimination across the tech industry, based on your skin color, gender, and political views.

Some are relatively mild, others will literally put resumes from the wrong group of people in the recycle bin. And the wrong groups are not the historically under represented ones.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#193

Post by throwaway47292 »

lmilcin wrote: post #188
throwaway47292 wrote: post #183

The bubble we (hn) live in, is turning against fb/google/evil corp for various reasons, but the truth is, like any corp they will have ups and downs, if this meta shit pays out (fortnite skins for 2 billion people is basically infinite money) they will just buy their way out. Or they will buy the devs in another way, like apple is buying them indirectly for 30% commission on their apps. Worse case, you get survivor b…

The trouble for FB is that best developers have free choice of where they are going to work. Yes, when you need to pay your bills and FB is going to pay a shit ton of money, most people will rationalize, bend and accept FB's offer. But when people have basically free choice of where they can work this is when most of them actually start paying attention to non-financial aspects of their decision. FB's model requires…

> The trouble for FB is that best developers have free choice of where they are going to work.

Thats in most companies no? The builders build from their heart. Until they get convinced to move somewhere very important as victims of their success and burnout. But you get 2-3 years of people giving their hearts out. Its what I call 'paying with love'. You know how they say 'do what you love and never work a day in your life', but what they dont say, is that you consuming that love, little by little, some day you will make a compromise, like an artist forced to paint something they dont agree with, and then again, and again.. until you start hating your brush.

> FB's model requires them to be able to hire a lot of really good developers. It may take some time, but if they have trouble hiring really good developers they will be starting to slide a slippery slope to mediocrity when they can easily be caught by competition.

I am not sure I agree with that, I dont think anybody's model requires constant input of really good developers, most things will work with ok devs, some sharded mysql, lots of ram and a bunch of materialization jobs.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#194

Post by erik_seaberg »

bogwog wrote: post #83
perdid0 wrote: post #71

> Out of more than 1,100 votes, the person was urged to take the Netflix job, where he said he was being offered $580,000 a year. Are these real salaries? How??

580k per year is reasonable considering the value that one engineer can provide to a company that large. also , I’ve heard that Netflix salaries in particular are higher than most other tech giants because they don’t offer any other benefits.

I think benefits are as usual and the salary is making up for no equity. They do sell discounted shares (and apparently OOTM ten year LEAPs?)

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#195

Post by [deleted] »

throwaway47292 wrote: post #193
lmilcin wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The trouble for FB is that best developers have free choice of where they are going to work. Yes, when you need to pay your bills and FB is going to pay a shit ton of money, most people will rationalize, bend and accept FB's offer. But when people have basically free choice of where they can work this is when most of them actually start paying attention to non-financial aspects of their decision. FB's model requires…

> The trouble for FB is that best developers have free choice of where they are going to work. Thats in most companies no? The builders build from their heart. Until they get convinced to move somewhere very important as victims of their success and burnout. But you get 2-3 years of people giving their hearts out. Its what I call 'paying with love'. You know how they say 'do what you love and never work a day in your…

[deleted]

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#196

Post by chillacy »

ghaff wrote: post #180
chillacy wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FAANG senior engineers get in around 350-400k and with recent stock appreciation some are hitting 400-600 depending on tenure and company performance. Source: levels.fyi

Which is an exceptional level relative to just about everyone except execs at larger public companies. It's by no means remotely normal.

Oh totally, but GP never said the words "normal", only "much"

> they don't get paid much

which is how I suppose we're on the topic of arguing the semantics of "much". I think GP should have said "as much" to clarify, since this is a comparison between two specific jobs.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#197

Post by gfodor »

lordnacho wrote: post #32

I would guess people evaluate their job on money/work/stink axes. All of FAANG pays well, so what's left is whether the work is interesting/important/fulfilling and whether the company has integrity/evil issues. Eg you might think F1 has interesting problems despite glorifying fossil fuel cars, or you might think drones are technically challenging despite being used to kill people. Loads of people become nurses and t…

These aren't independent axes. For example, more money can make it easier to feel like you are genuinely contributing, or rationalize the idea that negative public sentiment isn't real and fake media reports.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#198

Post by version_five »

lordnacho wrote: post #32

I would guess people evaluate their job on money/work/stink axes. All of FAANG pays well, so what's left is whether the work is interesting/important/fulfilling and whether the company has integrity/evil issues. Eg you might think F1 has interesting problems despite glorifying fossil fuel cars, or you might think drones are technically challenging despite being used to kill people. Loads of people become nurses and t…

> What you're less likely to do is work in an area where your work isn't interesting, contributes nothing significant, and rots people's minds.

Have you head of finance? What I think is that most current tech folks started their careers out of genuine interest, and so think along the lines you describe. But now that the money has really arrived, the balance will shift to the type-A aspirational folks who only care about the highest paying, most highly regarded career, and are looking for some FAANG->YC Startup->Management path. These people absolutely are happy to do whatever as long as they get external validation, and would have no compunction about working at FB as long as it keeps them on the track they planned.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#199

Post by 1vuio0pswjnm7 »

lordnacho wrote: post #32

I would guess people evaluate their job on money/work/stink axes. All of FAANG pays well, so what's left is whether the work is interesting/important/fulfilling and whether the company has integrity/evil issues. Eg you might think F1 has interesting problems despite glorifying fossil fuel cars, or you might think drones are technically challenging despite being used to kill people. Loads of people become nurses and t…

"I found it interesting that only half their job offers are taken up, that's super surprising to me."

It is not surprising if the goal is not to fill vacancies or expanding needs, but to prevent competing companies from having these people at their disposal. There will be enough offers to cover every possible person who could do this computer-focused work that might go to work for a competitor.

Another explanation is that there is a high attrition rate (e.g., like Amazon) and the company must overcompensate. Thus there will always be high numbers of advertisied positions that are never filled.

A third explanation is the company just has too much money and no clear ideas on how to spend it. (Case in point: Metaverse) Companies tend to sustain higher and higher levels of, for lack of a better term, "stupidity/foolishness" as the cash flow increases further and further beyond the company's immediate needs. Having heaps of cash on hand does not necessarily focus the mind; it can have the opposite effect.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#200

Post by grp000 »

jd115 wrote: post #72
freewilly1040 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They’ve certainly faced an onslaught from the press, which has decided they are Philip Morris 2.0. It’s very unclear if that is going to translate into actual legal trouble. If I was at FB I’d be more concerned with how young people are rejecting it.

Facebook's legal troubles are certainly not imaginary. They are actual, they are ongoing, they are overwhelming and there's more and more coming out all the time. Zuck and Thiel themselves are named as defendents on multiple very serious lawsuits which money alone could not spare them from (and not for lack of trying - untold billions have been spent in the past 5 years to ensure Zuck's name didn't show up on lawsuit…

I haven't been following FB, and wasn't aware that Zuckerberg could be liable for more than financial penalties. Is it regarding Cambridge Analytics? https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2021/10/20/tech...
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