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TV detector vans once prowled the streets of England

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Re: TV detector vans once prowled the streets of England

#191
post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am talking about the fact that the ARD itself is the collective group of all regional broadcasters (look up the name) and any programme is produced either by one of the regional broadcasters or by the shared production company Degeto. And of course is also shown in the "thirds". Take "Rote Rosen" (with questionable quality) and you will see it is also shown on rbb, hr, NDR and MDR.

> I am talking about the fact that the ARD itself is the collective group of all regional broadcasters (look up the name) I know that. But it's utterly offtopic in this subthread. We're not talking about organisational structures, we're talking about "what can I watch".

The organisational structure causes what you can watch where and I am arguing that garbage produced by the "Thirds" is not only dumped to Das Erste but shown elsewhere as well. You gave me the current programme, I gave you "Rote Rosen" but that did not convince you. Here is more: "Sturm der Liebe" shown on BR, hr, MDR, NDR and rbb, "Bristant" shown on MDR, "WaPo Bodensee" shown on SWR, hr, NDR and BR … that is not "pretty much nothing".

Re: TV detector vans once prowled the streets of England

#192

"Television license fees" are a peculiar concept if you've not lived in a country that requires them, but as another commenter pointed out, several countries, mainly in Europe but outside as well, have this "system" in place. Quite frankly it's ridiculous - imagine needing to pay a "fee" to CNN/Fox News/NYTimes/Yahoo/whatever-well-connected dotcom just because you have an internet connection and web browser.

> Quite frankly it's ridiculous - imagine needing to pay a "fee" to CNN/Fox News/NYTimes/Yahoo just because you have a internet connection and web browser.

This comparison is ridiculous. The license fee is a little outdated in certain aspects but it covers more than just broadcast news as the orgs you mentioned do.

The BBC has a broad remit to inform, educate, and entertain. Not in itself radically different to a lot of other broadcasters, and typical for a public service broadcaster, but the universal license fee is a key differentiator.

In requiring everyone with a television to contribute, the BBC has a duty to serve the entire population of a country, regardless of their income or demographic. This enables the BBC to produce content that may not be commercially viable for privately funded broadcasters that in term can serve communities that would otherwise be overlooked. BBC's Three and Four channels tend to best exemplify this aspect with content that can often be slightly niche and, in the case of Three, regularly have casts and production crews that are far more diverse than the industry averages.

The license fee is also independent of the state budget. The Government does have the power and oversight to adjust funding every 5-11 years, but the royal charter ensures that funding is separate from typical taxation and avoids the Treasury. This also ensures (in theory) that there is more autonomy for accurate, fair, and unbiased news reporting.

The BBC has also for most of its existence operated and maintained a lot of shared broadcasting infrastructure (which admittedly is less key as viewing moves away from terrestrial broadcast and towards IP services, and to a lesser extent cable and satellite). In the previous charter they also had a responsibility to improve broadband infrastructure in rural areas.

There's also a final aspect to this in that the BBC performs a lot of public service open research into emerging technologies as well as the social impact of them and different forms of media. Most media organisations don't care about anything other than how much of a person's attention they can capture at the expense of everything else. More eyes on a media org = more advertising sold. The BBC's model means they can actually give consideration to what healthy consumption is and how to promote digital wellbeing etc., as well as ensuring younger audiences are better catered for (there's a great article on how YouTube Kids has severely let down its young audiences in the past here: https://medium.com/@jamesbridle/something-is-wrong-on-the-in... )

Re: TV detector vans once prowled the streets of England

#193
post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my personal experience public funded TV stations are just a propaganda machine for the current ruling party.

I've always mostly known public funded radios to be actually quite critical of the current ruling party. I do not watch much televison but I would expect a similar behaviour. Howerver I guess it depends on the country you're from.

A ssome else pinted out, by funding public braodcasting directly they can afford to be critical. Were the fundid by a tax, collected by the gevernment, and handed out by the government this independance goes right out of the window. One of the lessons Germany learned from the Nazi regime with government controlled media.

Re: TV detector vans once prowled the streets of England

#194
I remember when I was doing my engineering degree asking my Electrical Engineering lecturer if he thought they could tell the difference between black and white and colour TVs. He thought not, which saved me a few quid.

Also worth noting that there is a campaign in the UK to get non-payment of license fees decriminalised and made into a civil offence.

"In 2017 (latest data available), 72 per cent of all prosecutions for TV licence-fee evasion were against women.

This figure is so high that licence-fee evasion accounted for 30 per cent of all prosecutions against women, the single most common charge."

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/women/tv-license-sc...

Re: TV detector vans once prowled the streets of England

#195
post #80
post #38

> The United Kingdom is somewhat unique in the world for requiring those households which view broadcast television to purchase a licence for the privilege. I know at least three countries (Germany, Austria and Switzerland) which do the same (edit: according the Wikipedia [0], such a fee exists in basically every European country, Japan, Israel, South Korea and Namibia). In Germany, the situation changed a few years…

> In Germany, the situation changed a few years ago, every household has to pay now, even if they don't own a television or radio. This was literally the first piece of mail I got when I moved to Germany: a letter demanding I pay for the TV networks I don't watch. I didn't even own a TV by that point, nor would have understood much of what was being said! A German explained to me once that the forced payment by non-w…

Note that you pay for much more than just the TV networks; international / English offers such as dw.com are also funded by this.

Re: TV detector vans once prowled the streets of England

#196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The UK only requires you to have a TV licence if you watch BBC iPlayer, or watch any live TV / stream, even if that content is not produced by the BBC. Also, recording something live in order to watch it later requires a TV licence. So, if you watch something live on Amazon Prime or YouTube, you need a TV licence. I don't know if the BBC define what 'live' actually means, there's always a delay. I have a TV but don't…

Live is something as broadcast by a U.K. licensed broadcaster. YouTube lives wouldn’t count for example, nor do zooms.

Unfortunately that is incorrect. You need a TV license even if you only watch foreign broadcasts: https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/faqs/FAQ16

Re: TV detector vans once prowled the streets of England

#197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So they can pretend their state TV is independent from the state.

How does the state exert power over the broadcasters if their income doesn't come from the government? Edit: When I say 'how' I don't mean 'why', I mean 'by what means'.

Because the broadcasters need politicians and courts to confirm that the TV protection money is constitutional.

It is protection money: You haven't ordered any service and if you don't pay they'll make you pay and ruin your credit score in the process.

In the collection process they pretend to be a government institution to avoid going through local courts, which sometimes are against them.

EDIT: Also, I'm beginning to wonder why any criticism of the German government or especially state TV is being downvoted here. Civil servants have a lot of time ...

Re: TV detector vans once prowled the streets of England

#198
post #91
post #38

> The United Kingdom is somewhat unique in the world for requiring those households which view broadcast television to purchase a licence for the privilege. I know at least three countries (Germany, Austria and Switzerland) which do the same (edit: according the Wikipedia [0], such a fee exists in basically every European country, Japan, Israel, South Korea and Namibia). In Germany, the situation changed a few years…

At least in the UK there is content on TV worthy of watching (I got addicted to snooker while there, also some quite interesting shows like "Benefits Britain: Life on the Dole"), also, when I moved overseas they paid back the licence fee for the remaining part of the year, no questions asked. Now I'm in Austria and the "content" on TV channels is just ridiculous. Targeted at 70+ pensioners, but why should I pay for t…

Unfortunately the only demographic that really kept watching Austrian stations is pensioners, and sports fans (the amount of skiing tournaments on our main station in winter is ridiculous).

Everyone else often had cable or SAT, which gave you all the German and also Swiss networks, particularly the private ones, where the program is aimed at different demographics (also possible because of vastly larger pockets: German ad market >> Austrian ad market)

At least ORF tried to modernize its image, but do you want to lose your main demographic as well? Can you compete (financially) with German private TV and pay TV? Not to mention Netflix, Disney+, etc? There is not really a way out.

So were stuck with Skiing, Austrian Soccer, Tatort and Gaming show clones. At least there is a lot of cooperation/joint shopping with German and Swiss (public) stations.

The self-created German content could be worse though. Tatort can be quite nice, it is not aiming to be CSI - and that can be a good thing.

Re: TV detector vans once prowled the streets of England

#199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would very strongly recommend you invest a day or two in trying Radio 4 - just put it on in the background all day, and see what you find.

Careful though, they might stumble on The Archers or one of those terribly over acted radio plays that are on in the afternoon.

...and find they get hooked on the goings-on in Ambridge, and lose 15 minutes of their life every day?

Re: TV detector vans once prowled the streets of England

#200

"Television license fees" are a peculiar concept if you've not lived in a country that requires them, but as another commenter pointed out, several countries, mainly in Europe but outside as well, have this "system" in place. Quite frankly it's ridiculous - imagine needing to pay a "fee" to CNN/Fox News/NYTimes/Yahoo/whatever-well-connected dotcom just because you have an internet connection and web browser.

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