China's social credit system is both unique and part of a global trend • Hacker News Board

Re: China's social credit system is both unique and part of a global trend

#191

Post by chillacy » Wed, Sep 30, 2020, 5:08 AM UTC

reaperducer wrote: post #31

vmception wrote: post #4

Like the article mentions, private sector credit systems have the same or similar result in dictating outcomes, but as long as its not from the state, nobody in the west will care about it. Which is very weird because it is exactly how people end up living in worse neighborhoods even if they have enough money to pay rent elsewhere, leading to worse and worse outcomes and no way to change that. A state sanctioned one…

private sector credit systems have the same or similar result in dictating outcomes, but as long as its not from the state, nobody in the west will care about it If I do something bad, like file for bankruptcy, it is wiped off of the "private sector credit systems" after seven years. China's scorekeeping is perpetual. There is no forgiveness. No second chances. Another important difference is that in the West, being…

I saw a documentary a year ago and it looked like in one of the credit schemes people literally just "donated money" to increase their scores, so you can improve your score... but it also looked kind of like bribery with more steps (esp if there's charity vetting).

Re: China's social credit system is both unique and part of a global trend

#192

Post by chillacy » Wed, Sep 30, 2020, 5:11 AM UTC

ardy42 wrote: post #21

AlexTWithBeard wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A standard US credit score system may seem to be similar, but there are some important differences: - a person has access to their file - there are ways to correct mistakes on file, should any be found - scoring algorithm is more or less known

> A standard US credit score system may seem to be similar, but there are some important differences: Also: - it's limited in scope to financial accounts. The end goal of the Chinese system appears to be to rate you on nearly every aspect of your life, which is quite different.

If you look at the history of the US credit system, it used to be about other aspects of like (a bank employee factored in if you went to church, were an alcoholic, etc) and it resulted in low access to credit, especially to minorities. That it eventually became regulated and limited to the financial domain was actually a huge feature of the credit system in America that unlocked a lot of good things.

So from the US point of view, a "social credit system" seems backwards in a "been there, tried that" kind of thing.

Re: China's social credit system is both unique and part of a global trend

#193

Post by chillacy » Wed, Sep 30, 2020, 5:22 AM UTC

This article is content marketing for a VPN service, not so much interesting content as much as demand generation for their product.

Re: China's social credit system is both unique and part of a global trend

#194

Post by abc-xyz » Wed, Sep 30, 2020, 6:15 PM UTC

avaldeso wrote: post #110

abc-xyz wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In China's case, it is only as good as the CCP dictator. What if the next leader of CCP is corrupt or even worse, incompetent af? You make it sound like their current leader, who’s no better than Hitler, isn’t corrupt and incompetent af. His incompetence just caused a pandemic that has killed millions of people.

Covid 19 death toll as September 28 is 1 million [1]. Not millions. Please, don't spread misinformation. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus

You’d have to be a fool to believe the numbers coming out of China, there’s also been a great increase in suicides and job losses (especially in countries like Thailand and the Philippines).

But you’re right, we have a million deaths that can directly be linked to the Wuhan Virus.

Re: China's social credit system is both unique and part of a global trend

#195

Post by kelnos » Fri, Oct 02, 2020, 4:29 AM UTC

aeternum wrote: post #148

kelnos wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Private sector credit systems allow you to examine your record and appeal to get incorrect information corrected, with a legal framework in place that ensures the credit bureau actually acts on your complaints. Also their scope is limited: if I show that I can't be trusted with credit, the result of my low credit score is that it becomes harder for me to get more credit. With China's social credit system, me habitual…

> Also their scope is limited Is this really true in the US? Increasingly I've been surprised at all the places that want to pull credit. Cellphone companies, electric company, applying to rent an apt, even HR departments.

With the exception of the HR department, those other people/groups do have an interest in ensuring that you'll pay your bills on time.

If you're on a cellular plan where you get the phone free/cheap and then pay it off over the next year or two, that's a creditor relationship. Postpaid plans mean that you pay your bill at the end of the month, so if you fail to pay, the phone company has lost money on you. Prepaid plans, IIRC, usually don't require a credit check because you pay up-front.

Even for the electric company, there are often laws against shutting off your service because of non-payment, since electricity is considered so fundamental to our lives. And again, like cellular can be, it's a post-paid service.

Renting an apartment isn't quite so obviously a credit thing, but in many jurisdictions it's difficult and expensive to evict a tenant, even for non-payment.