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On not choosing WordPress for the W3C redesign project

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Re: On not choosing WordPress for the W3C redesign project

#191

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Not sure. My impression is Gatsby is solid but still growing, the tech still evolving. So today might not be the same answer next month.

This sounds like the hype I mentioned earlier if I'm honest. I'd rather just use Hugo today and know most small sites I make are going to build in less than a second without having to pay extra.

It's not static, pun intended. The Gatsby of 6 or 12 months ago is not the Gatsby of today. Buzz? Maybe. But buzz !== hype.

Re: On not choosing WordPress for the W3C redesign project

#192
post #179

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> This is one of the reasons we started maintaining what is essentially a WordPress-for-enterprise distro, with a mix of first- and third-party code. Is this available publicly? Most of my work these days is putting right WordPress sites (and setting up Varnish and ESI) rather than building them, but this would be of interest.

It sure is, and fully open source. https://www.altis-dxp.com/ ( https://www.altis-dxp.com/resources/docs/getting-started/#cr... to jump straight to the download from Composer stuff; https://github.com/humanmade/altis for the repo)

This looks very useful - thanks.

The pre-approved plugin list (https://www.altis-dxp.com/resources/pre-approved-plugins/) returns 404 though :(

Re: On not choosing WordPress for the W3C redesign project

#193
post #95

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Meanwhile, the core lacks: multilingual, CDN support, caching. Essentials.

Those don't belong in core either. Core should focus strictly on the being a rock solid foundation. Plugins are there to supplement that. That's the beauty of the architecture. Or at least, is supposed to be. WordPress should not have the same mindset as Jetpack. Oops? Did I just say that?? ;)

WP is useless without CDN and caching.

Re: On not choosing WordPress for the W3C redesign project

#194

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I'm obviously in my own bubble, but I don't understand people complaining about WordPress. WordPress is by far the worst CMS you could possibly use, every other single CMS is better in every capacity. Let's go through why - Uses PHP 5 spaghetti code with a handful of garbage event listeners and output buffering - Has no integration with composer at all - Doesn't have any form of content types without plugins - Has no…

https://wpackagist.org/

An Outlandish experiment.

Yes I know there is third-party plugins and services. I mean "core" wordpress. Not what a bunch of other's built.

Re: On not choosing WordPress for the W3C redesign project

#195
post #57

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WP is php, and it tends to take a ton of plugins of various quality, vendors and support to get it to where you want it. Last I looked at it, it didn’t even support multi-language out of the box.

That’s a feature not a bug. >90% of the websites don’t care about multi-language. Why should their CMS be more complex just to carter the rest? Plugins nicely separate the concern and let the authors of the plugins get paid for their efforts.

Typical American viewpoint that is. In European markets it is probably the inverse, most sites need multi language support. For a content management system I find it pretty poor to be missing this.

Re: On not choosing WordPress for the W3C redesign project

#196
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s a feature not a bug. >90% of the websites don’t care about multi-language. Why should their CMS be more complex just to carter the rest? Plugins nicely separate the concern and let the authors of the plugins get paid for their efforts.

Typical American viewpoint that is. In European markets it is probably the inverse, most sites need multi language support. For a content management system I find it pretty poor to be missing this.

Indeed, I thought for a moment about Switzerland, that might have one of the highest rate of multilingual websites at least in Europe.

I wasn’t able to find what fraction of the Internet sites are multilingual but would be curious what’s your estimate. I still would be surprised if it is >10%. Maybe more if you weight by traffic but that is not the relevant metric here.

The plug-in approach has another advantage: there are several reasonable approaches to a multilingual site, i.e. you can have a default language if a translation is not available. Or rather show nothing. You may want to force a translation of each page. How do you track the translation of changes in one language, etc.

By picking/adjusting a plug-in you get the behavior you want instead of a one approach satisfies nobody default solution.

Re: On not choosing WordPress for the W3C redesign project

#197
post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Typical American viewpoint that is. In European markets it is probably the inverse, most sites need multi language support. For a content management system I find it pretty poor to be missing this.

Indeed, I thought for a moment about Switzerland, that might have one of the highest rate of multilingual websites at least in Europe. I wasn’t able to find what fraction of the Internet sites are multilingual but would be curious what’s your estimate. I still would be surprised if it is >10%. Maybe more if you weight by traffic but that is not the relevant metric here. The plug-in approach has another advantage: the…

* first of all I think that not translating web content is leaving big chunks of potential markets by the wayside. the whole point of the web is that people are able to find you and your offerings worldwide - maybe they could be a fit in places you didn’t expect? [1]

* I’ve dealt with these WP multilingual plugins and they were all atrocious (see my first comment). Nowadays, if I have a core set of requirements, and a piece of software only offers that set through plugins, I will not consider it anymore. Plugins are fine for nice-to-haves, but not for must-haves. It’s a recipy for a maintainability disaster.

[1] https://weglot.com/wp-content/uploads/20191017121225/image16...

Re: On not choosing WordPress for the W3C redesign project

#198

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Can you recommend any plugins in particular or a place you'd trust for plugin recommendations? > Lots of plugins are complicated because they want to enable ordinary users to customize their behavior, which you don't need if you have even basic php skills Yes, I've realised this too. Generally you pay for the features + customisability you don't use as well. E.g. if you want to add social sharing icons yourself, just…

I can't recommend anything beyond ACF (and that I'm somewhat hesitant, it has a few annoyances) and maybe Autoptimize (feels stable, but haven't worked with a lot). I work with Yoast a lot because clients like it and editors know it, but I wouldn't recommend it. I hate all Permalink-Plugins I've ever seen. I don't do any caching in WP, I use varnish. Otherwise I experienced exactly what you mentioned. Install a plugi…

With regards to Yoast SEO, I stepped away from that. Over the past few years there have been many instances where an admin_notice could not be removed. The last straw for me was last Black Friday sale, with a yellow flashing banner on all my admin pages. Not fun.

I use The SEO Framework now on most of my sites, and it is a good experience. It is made by someone who cares about his users instead of wanting to milk them.

https://wordpress.org/plugins/autodescription/

If you need to move data over from SEO plugin to SEO plugin, check out the Data Transporter plugin. https://wordpress.org/plugins/seo-data-transporter/

Re: On not choosing WordPress for the W3C redesign project

#199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does Gatsby build fast enough for a large site though? I find their business model strange if I'm understanding it correctly - faster builds are a paid feature. I also don't understand the hype. I think it's just good marketing, people don't know the alternatives, and it uses React. I usually side with Hugo because it's so fast and simple to get running. I don't love the template language but the majority of sites do…

Fast enough depends on your needs. I work on a Gatsby site that builds ~9k pages in ~9 minutes in AWS CodeBuild. We're looking forward to implementing incremental builds at some point, but our current build time is acceptable. I see Gatsby similar to Django in that it has "batteries included" for building a modern interactive site. It suits our needs quite well and I'm really happy with it.

For what it's worth, a quick test of Hugo with 10K posts with a minimal theme takes 40 seconds to build. Speed isn't everything but x10 faster is nice.

Re: On not choosing WordPress for the W3C redesign project

#200

It's no wonder, Craft is a great pick. I've built numerous sites with it and it works like a charm. What they nailed down is that it has great UX for content creators and developers as well. The speed at which you can build sites is amazing. You can even build your startup MVP with it if you consider it as a headless, REST API prototype tool. Data modelling is where it excels. I guess I have to stop praising, it star…

I love Craft's data structure. What WordPress mashes together as custom post types, Craft natively implements as entries, which are arbitrary collections of fields.

It's also trivial to keep under source control.

My only gripe with Craft is Redactor, which can easily be replaced.

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