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Indian police open case against hundreds in Kashmir for using VPN

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Re: Indian police open case against hundreds in Kashmir for using VPN

#191

Post by nine_zeros »

lonesword wrote: post #99
nine_zeros wrote: post #67

Very sad. But a great lesson for the rest of the world. Democracy with an uneducated populace is a disaster waiting to happen

So the solution would be to not have democracy until the unwashed uneducated masses become otherwise so? The East India company would've agreed with you :p

No. That is stupid. The solution is to make sure that education is never skimped on.

The lesson for countries like US that are cutting education in favor of tax cuts is that lack of education in a electoral democracy is a self-fulfilling disaster.

Re: Indian police open case against hundreds in Kashmir for using VPN

#192

Post by aniketpant »

shripadk wrote: post #95
arsalanb wrote: post #13

When I left Kashmir a few months ago, my phone and all its contents were checked by Indian police at the airport. They asked me to unlock and checked photos, WhatsApp texts, etc. Random arrests and extra-judicial killings of Kashmiris by the Indian state is a quite regular occurrence. A laughable narrative around how they were "Pakistan sponsored terrorists" is usually spun by the media/police nexus.

> A laughable narrative around how they were "Pakistan sponsored terrorists" is usually spun by the media/police nexus. So who conducted the Pulwama terror attack? Have you seen the video of the terrorist and the filth that he utters against Hindus? It is obvious that Pakistan is involved in sponsoring terror. They are in the grey list in FATF for a reason and have two of the World's most dangerous terrorists: Masood…

Let's not push the narrative of Kashmir being peaceful after the abrogation of Article 370 without any meaningful metric for the same.

Re: Indian police open case against hundreds in Kashmir for using VPN

#193

Post by dang »

xkemp wrote: post #156
friendly_fren wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you think nationalism is bad?

Just look at the ugly violence of nationalistic hatred currently gripping, oh I don't know.. let's say India ? If that's too much recursion, consider the World War I and II (among many others), both being based essentially in nationalism.

You've been breaking the site guidelines repeatedly in multiple threads on divisive topics by snarking, getting personal, posting flamebait, and so on. That's not cool. Would you please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to the rules from now on? Note this one: "Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive."

Re: Indian police open case against hundreds in Kashmir for using VPN

#194

Post by stordoff »

shripadk wrote: post #106
1ris wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Suppressing secession is tyranny. India should know a thing or two about that.

No one suppressed secession. There have been secession movements not just in Kashmir but in North East too. That doesn't give anyone the authority to conduct terror attacks on fellow citizens. When things go beyond a point of no return then force is needed. Since the day India Abrogated Article 370 there hasn't been one major terror attack in Kashmir. That is good enough for the rest of India that was sick and tired…

> Would you be willing to have your Nation broken up into multiple pieces because some Tom, Dick or Harry doesn't like the way it is now?

As someone who conceivably sees this happening to his country in the relatively near future (English; Scotland leaving the UK), I'm not sure it's my right to prevent the secession of an identifiable group/country/region (the special status under Article 370 seems to suggest Jammu and Kashmir _might_ be such) against their will.

> Since the day India Abrogated Article 370 there hasn't been one major terror attack in Kashmir.

Only six months on from abrogation I'd be somewhat reluctant to draw any firm conclusions. Based on my limited understanding, major attacks do not seem to be have been of such a frequency that you would necessarily expect one to occur within that six month period.

Re: Indian police open case against hundreds in Kashmir for using VPN

#195

Post by dntbnmpls »

screye wrote: post #22
aarongray wrote: post #3

It's really too bad that the two rising tech countries - China and India - have such a third-world approach to censorship on the Internet. You would think they would want to mimic the US's successful formula in hopes of building their presence as a tech powerhouse, but in this area they don't seem to be doing that.

We have yet to see how the US reacts when a massive section of it wants to secede. India and China both face a significantly more difficult geopolitical reality than the USA. Some of the world's most westernized and developed countries (Spain, Israel) are starting to use violence and suppressive tactics now that they are faced with even the smallest amount of secessionist unrest. Kashmir is one of the most militarize…

> We have yet to see how the US reacts when a massive section of it wants to secede.

Shutdown hundreds of critical newspapers. Suspended habeus corpus. And war.

https://wiki.lincolntelegrams.com/index.php?title=Lincoln_an...

Not to mention an unrealistic threat of secession led to the deportation of up to 2 million mexican americans.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican_Repatriation

Which was tied to

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zimmermann_Telegram

and accelerated due to the Great Depression.

Of course the fear that japanese americans may try to secede and align with japan got them put in concentration camps.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment_of_Japanese_America...

> India and China both face a significantly more difficult geopolitical reality than the USA.

Both of them face separatism funded by foreign nations which adds an extra level of concern.

> but to act as though a USA like policy would work in countries with very different ground realities is being willfully arrogant.

If you think this is ignorant, go look up US views on free trade and protectionism. In the media, you'll see everyone say the US has always been pro-free trade. History shows otherwise.

President Abraham Lincoln declared, "Give us a protective tariff and we will have the greatest nation on earth." Lincoln warned that "the abandonment of the protective policy by the American Government ... must produce want and ruin among our people."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protectionism_in_the_United_St...

Almost all the commonly held beliefs we've been brainwashed to accept by the media are simply lies. Democracy? Ask the bolivians, venezuelans, iranians, etc. Freedom? Ask the slaves in libya or the poor slaving away in saudi arabia, kuwait, etc.

Re: Indian police open case against hundreds in Kashmir for using VPN

#196

Post by legolas2412 »

aniketpant wrote: post #192
shripadk wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A laughable narrative around how they were "Pakistan sponsored terrorists" is usually spun by the media/police nexus. So who conducted the Pulwama terror attack? Have you seen the video of the terrorist and the filth that he utters against Hindus? It is obvious that Pakistan is involved in sponsoring terror. They are in the grey list in FATF for a reason and have two of the World's most dangerous terrorists: Masood…

Let's not push the narrative of Kashmir being peaceful after the abrogation of Article 370 without any meaningful metric for the same.

I'm not sure what your argument is. Are you only opposing cutting off internet or are you opposed to kashmir's "occupation"?

There are many factors that make the abrogation the right move. We shouldn't be dividing a secular country for another Islamic state. Jammu and Leh should not be held back by religious based separatism. Even if Kashmir turns more violent, not giving into theocratic demands for another Islamic state is the right thing to do.

Maybe cutting off internet and house arrest of politicians was not the right moves, but neither was the status quo of perpetual autonomy and jihadi separatists.

Disclaimer, as I should add one. I'm no bjp supporter, and i hate the hindutva guys the same as I do the islamist crowd. After all, we call bjp making india a hindu pakistan. The word pakistan is derogatory here.

Re: Indian police open case against hundreds in Kashmir for using VPN

#197

Post by yumraj »

owaislone wrote: post #155
yumraj wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was it peaceful enough that Kashmiri Pandits could return without fear of being killed? If no, then it was not peaceful..

Not sure what that has to do with BANNING 10 MILLION PEOPLE FROM USING INTERNET for 5 months and then banning all social media but from my experience of meeting Pandits in Srinagar who HAVE returned, yes. Plus, OP implied that Kashmir is peaceful now because of people not having internet access. Are you now saying until Pandits return, Kashmir will have no internet access?

- I was replying to the claim that J&K was peaceful, which it clearly was not. We cannot claim that since it was peaceful for one community, it was peaceful.

- per the media reports that I've seen, no Kashmiri Pandits have dared to return. The only few that are in the valley are the ones who could not migrate, primarily due to economic reasons. Rest have been living as refugees in their own country

- Internet had been used by terrorists and their sympathizors, and that is a fact

Re: Indian police open case against hundreds in Kashmir for using VPN

#198

Post by nostrebored »

vbezhenar wrote: post #70
RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #14

This is a reminder that without physical security, electronic security is pretty much worthless. The best encryption won't save you from rubberhose cryptanalysis where they beat you until you reveal your key. Clever circumvention technologies such as VPN won't save you when they arrest your for using circumvention technologies. These are all good things, but we in tech, oftentimes think we can program our way out of…

Circumvention technologies must be used by everyone, so you can't filter out some people. It's very fun how Kazakhstan government worked against himself. They blocked a lot of websites including harmless ones (like pornhub) and plenty of useful ones (probably by mistake) along with opposition websites. So basically most of computer-literate people now have VPN ready to use and many people use it all the time, myself…

I'm not sure if "Harmless like a site that has been exposed for hosting rape videos of minors" is the rabbit hole you wanted to jump down.

From the perspective of a hostile government it's safe to assume that people VPN'ing to known CIDRs of VPNs are doing something subversive. I don't think this is really giving people much security as far as casual visiting goes.

Finding out what they're doing on opposition websites is a much better argument though.

Re: Indian police open case against hundreds in Kashmir for using VPN

#199

Post by thbr99 »

InitialLastName wrote: post #83
thbr99 wrote: post #63

The India government is taking action against spreading misinformation & fake news via VPN enabled social media. What is wrong here. Title is misleading and sensationalist.

What's "wrong" is that it's very difficult to tell the difference between this and "The Indian government is taking action against spreading information and news via VPN enabled social media"

So if it's difficult to tell the difference, why celebrate one side of the story and that too by a western media which has no idea about the ground realities in Kashmir. The article is also written by someone who is not an expert in political journalism. Techcrunch should stick what it does best.

Re: Indian police open case against hundreds in Kashmir for using VPN

#200

Post by aniketpant »

legolas2412 wrote: post #196
aniketpant wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's not push the narrative of Kashmir being peaceful after the abrogation of Article 370 without any meaningful metric for the same.

I'm not sure what your argument is. Are you only opposing cutting off internet or are you opposed to kashmir's "occupation"? There are many factors that make the abrogation the right move. We shouldn't be dividing a secular country for another Islamic state. Jammu and Leh should not be held back by religious based separatism. Even if Kashmir turns more violent, not giving into theocratic demands for another Islamic s…

Opposed to both. I should have been clearer.

As the parent comment appears to assume that the decisions taken by the government in Kashmir are tied to the terrorism in the valley as opposed to being mere line items in their manifesto that stems from their political ideology. So assuming what they're saying is correct, I only wish to understand the metric for peace.

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