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Estonia is running its country like a tech company

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Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#191

Post by juskrey »

redisman wrote: post #181
juskrey wrote: post #103

I had a pretty intense honeymoon with Estonia, even had a relatively popular blog on e-residency, have visited Estonia twice (great experience btw).. And, after four years, I have reopened my company in UK and trying to liquidate my Estonian one (today I have received a denial letter which says that only Estonian citizen can close my company).. In short: Vague frequently changing rules, introduction of strange comple…

> Has TONS AND TONS of proper official information with tutorials. I'm not too familiar with the e-residence in Estonia but I'm not surprised that a country of 1.3M people that fairly recently escaped from underneath the iron curtain doesn't have the resources of the big EU countries who have had centuries of financial power. I'll say starting a business in the US was 100x easier than the EU countries I've stayed in.

This is true, still I am, as a, so to say, customer, just making a choice which works better, that was my point.

BTW have started a company in US also - can confirm that was also easy. But one needs to have a bank account in US, and US banks are not remote friendly, after opening an account too (I had an accident with account locking, lots of grey hair from nothing). I know Stripe Atlas makes this easier now.

Also my experience in UK proves it is not exactly a EU - much easier too. And GOV.UK is something extraordinary.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#192

Post by juskrey »

kapuasuite wrote: post #174
juskrey wrote: post #103

I had a pretty intense honeymoon with Estonia, even had a relatively popular blog on e-residency, have visited Estonia twice (great experience btw).. And, after four years, I have reopened my company in UK and trying to liquidate my Estonian one (today I have received a denial letter which says that only Estonian citizen can close my company).. In short: Vague frequently changing rules, introduction of strange comple…

The point about the accountants is interesting - might be a good opportunity to reach out to the professional association for Estonian accountants (if such a thing exists) to give some feedback.

This is just not a mature market. Also I suspect there are separate markets for locals and foreigners..

Just a business address can be easily 5x of what one has to pay in US or EU, and this is given Estonian govt really doesn't send you any letters there, in UK and US does.

BTW just learned company closure takes months and 400-1600 EUR, depending on whom you ask..

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#193

Post by lagadu »

csomar wrote: post #122
lagadu wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How recently? I opened an account for my Estonian company as an e-resident (from the EU) in Q1 2019 and it took a grand total of ~40 minutes at the bank to get everything working. I had to visit the bank HQ in person but the whole process was really really smooth sailing.

What documentation did they ask for?

The company's details (which was already up and running and registered in Estonia) which were provided by my accounting services and my e-residency ID. Once there I also needed to provide my national ID card (Portuguese), EU citizens from countries that don't have that would have had to provide a passport instead.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#194

Post by lagadu »

marcosdumay wrote: post #126
lagadu wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How recently? I opened an account for my Estonian company as an e-resident (from the EU) in Q1 2019 and it took a grand total of ~40 minutes at the bank to get everything working. I had to visit the bank HQ in person but the whole process was really really smooth sailing.

It doesn't really matter how smooth it is, the entire point of e-residency is lost if you have to personally go there once in a while. The fact that the meeting only takes 40 minutes is just extra injury if you had to travel 6000km to get there.

To be clear, I did that because I wanted the convenience of having Leapin to also have access to my accounts so they'd handle my invoicing and expenses without any significant trouble for me (ie. sending them the account movements periodically). Originally I had an electronic payments account in a Finnish bank and for that I didn't have to travel anywhere but I needed a full bank account so I'd be able to pay dividends into it so I went there. If I just wanted to pay myself via salary I wouldn't have needed to travel there at all but I'd rather my income be via dividends than via a salary because of tax purposes in my country of residence.

That said, I could've used a business account opened in other banks (including outside of Estonia) to do that but I'd be missing out on the convenience that is them having access to the account.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#195

Post by throw130 »

juskrey wrote: post #103

I had a pretty intense honeymoon with Estonia, even had a relatively popular blog on e-residency, have visited Estonia twice (great experience btw).. And, after four years, I have reopened my company in UK and trying to liquidate my Estonian one (today I have received a denial letter which says that only Estonian citizen can close my company).. In short: Vague frequently changing rules, introduction of strange comple…

Sure, I agree UK is a better option. Are you a UK resident though?

I'm a EU resident and I have heard there is no way to open a business bank account in the UK without living there (i.e. without NI number + rent contract + utility bills).

If anyone has any info on how to run a UK company with a local bank account (not with an Internet bank) without being a UK resident, I'm all ears.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#196

Post by juskrey »

throw130 wrote: post #195
juskrey wrote: post #103

I had a pretty intense honeymoon with Estonia, even had a relatively popular blog on e-residency, have visited Estonia twice (great experience btw).. And, after four years, I have reopened my company in UK and trying to liquidate my Estonian one (today I have received a denial letter which says that only Estonian citizen can close my company).. In short: Vague frequently changing rules, introduction of strange comple…

Sure, I agree UK is a better option. Are you a UK resident though? I'm a EU resident and I have heard there is no way to open a business bank account in the UK without living there (i.e. without NI number + rent contract + utility bills). If anyone has any info on how to run a UK company with a local bank account (not with an Internet bank) without being a UK resident, I'm all ears.

I'm not a UK resident and running it with Transferwise borderless account, and have opened several accounts in other fintech banks as an experiment as well.

As for Estonia, de facto e-residents have to open accounts in internet and non Estonian banks too.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#197

Post by easymodex »

wenc wrote: post #178
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven’t used checks routinely for the last 20 years in the states. I’m always really annoyed when some random niche activity requires it and can’t accept an online transfer. Then I have to go to the bank and get a temporary one.

Checks still have lower transaction fees for large amounts than most electronic forms do payment (cost: a postage stamp). I was looking for electronic ways to send a substantial wad of money domestically once and almost all electronic transfer providers wanted a percentage. Would be interested to know if there are any online services that can match the transaction fee of a check.

Cryptocurrencies.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#198

Post by stebann »

dimitar wrote: post #55

No opinion on Estonia and its e-government, but running a country like a tech company sounds like a plot of a comedy set in a dystopia. I certainly hope that Estonia is ran better than most tech company Tech companies have many problems that I don't want see in a Government: - Security breaches (and just like every other tech company Bulgaria recently had a dump of the personal data of 5 million citizens) - Privacy i…

Wow! Exactly the same I thought about the article. Also it has to do with country's scale as Estonia can afford to take risks given their small population size comparing to, say, UK. By the way, some observations can be just "Hype", because whether your country relies on tech or not, tech adaptation for society welfare and political welfare is more about pragmatics than planning.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#200

Post by alko4141 »

api_or_ipa wrote: post #173

I've heard so much about Estonia's digital economy, but I struggle to see the effect it has on it's own economy. Now, my data might be bad, but a cursory look at Estonia's GDP growth rate shows perfectly normal growth alongside Lithuania and Latvia [0]. Using Latvia and Lithuania to control for a digital economy, Estonia should see greater growth, but it doesn't. If going head-first into a digital economy had a signi…

Lithuania itself is pretty good at digital economy and has pretty strong fintech scene for the country that size.
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