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Wikipedia Is Now a Brave Verified Publisher

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Re: Wikipedia Is Now a Brave Verified Publisher

#191
Lots of specific comments here about Brave, pro and con.

I would like to explain where I think it fits in the larger scheme of things. There is broad agreement that the web is deeply broken, with all sorts of bad consequences, because of how web sites get their money from advertisements and selling data.

Now the only way this is going to get fixed, as far as I can tell, is for someone to come up with an alternative financial model that publishers will actually adopt.

There are many projects working on coming up with this. Brave seems to be a lot further along than anyone else, and so I hope it succeeds. Either that or that someone else does.

Re: Wikipedia Is Now a Brave Verified Publisher

#192
post #8

I don’t want BATs and I don’t want ads. I want to be able to donate to content creators through Apple Pay instantly.

I don't see why it would matter what form you're paying the creator in. I suppose in the absence of an apple pay direct link, you'd have to just use apple pay to pay for BAT. I think there's some sort of "re-fill $X/month" feature, but I can't seem to find it. https://brave.com/funding-your-brave-wallet/

I want content and I want to pay for it and I don’t want to think about it.

When this system is build into iOS and abstracted into a dollar amount that I use my face to pay, I will consider it.

Re: Wikipedia Is Now a Brave Verified Publisher

#193
post #12

I really like what Brave is doing. I wish it was built on Firefox instead of Chromium. I just don't see myself leaving Firefox without major upheaval in the browser space.

“ I wish it was built on Firefox instead of Chromium. “ I commented in another thread. This is one area where Mozilla has failed. It should have been the goto engine for projects like Electron or Brave or even MS Edge instead of Chromium. But the last time I looked Mozilla was not very friendly towards developers who want to use their engine.

Presumably they don't want to split their Google funding.

Re: Wikipedia Is Now a Brave Verified Publisher

#194

We signed up for Brave's setup at PortableApps.com after a few users asked about it. They hold your last 90 days in escrow, so you can find out how successful it is once you sign up. We were looking at around 10 cents a day for a bit under a million monthly users for that timeframe over the summer. And we can't even access it since Brave only works with one crypto provider and they aren't licensed in New York. The pr…

> 10 cents a day for a bit under a million monthly users To clarify, do you mean a million monthly Brave users? Or just a million monthly users in general? 10 cents a day might actually be a lot if you were only getting one or two Brave users a month.

Users in general. We can't track Brave users because it blocks Google Analytics.

Re: Wikipedia Is Now a Brave Verified Publisher

#195

We signed up for Brave's setup at PortableApps.com after a few users asked about it. They hold your last 90 days in escrow, so you can find out how successful it is once you sign up. We were looking at around 10 cents a day for a bit under a million monthly users for that timeframe over the summer. And we can't even access it since Brave only works with one crypto provider and they aren't licensed in New York. The pr…

Uphold is working hard to acquire the bitlicense for New York. They shared on Twitter earlier this month that they hope to have this resolved soon. It's worth noting that Creators also have a referral program whereby $5 in BAT can be earned for each user brought to the Brave platform. brave.com/refer Thank you for your incredible patience and participation. We hope to see positive developments on the bitlicense front…

Thanks for the details jonathan, but the referral program is a bad fit for PortableApps.com. Brave isn't interested in our standardized portable software format (download, install, auto-update, and manage hundreds of real apps in one system using an open format and open source tools). And the browser's 'portable mode' itself isn't actually portable. In fairness, though, all Chrome-ish browsers are broken portably.

Re: Wikipedia Is Now a Brave Verified Publisher

#196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(Brave employee here) Curious: what are some of the shortfalls you see in Chromium? Before I joined Brave, the desktop browser was originally using Gecko (from Firefox). Ultimately, there were some problems and the decision was made to move to Chromium. On iOS, Brave is forked from Firefox though You can check out more detail on Reddit where folks asked why FF was not used (which has links to more detailed info): htt…

Easy. Google has a lot of influence over Chromium development.

Presumably they also have a veto, at least, on Firefox development as they're paying handsomely for it?

Re: Wikipedia Is Now a Brave Verified Publisher

#197
Looking into this only briefly, it didn't take long to find a lot of very questionable decisions made by Brave:

1. They're positioning themselves as both an advertiser and a privacy advocate[1], which strikes me as more of a strategy for bootstrapping revenue than a trustworthy moral position. The entire point of crypto micropayments is to pay for content with crypto rather than attention/privacy. Why should I view Brave's ads rather than the other ads on the internet from advertisers who also claim their ads respect privacy? The fact that Brave has decided to get into bed with advertisers at all shows they're committed to profit, not to users: micropayments are just a way to diversify for Brave, which will quickly fall to the wayside if it fails to provide the revenue they want.

2. The entire concept of a Brave Verified Publisher stinks. It positions Brave as a censor. If this system takes off, then suddenly Brave has control over who gets paid for content on the internet, and can censor content they don't like. And this isn't hypothetical, they plan to do this: their TOS[2] explicitly contains a code of conduct which contains a long list of things they will terminate your account for: they promise to use their power as censors to enforce of US copyright/patent law and also a wide variety of subjective social norms. This also shows their commitment to being an advertiser rather than an application that serves users: if you're serving users then you let them pay for the content they want to pay for, but if you're serving advertisers, then you can't let advertisers brands be seen as supporting questionable content.

3. BAT based in Ethereum seems to be basically a way to ride the wave of cryptocurrency hype while still positioning themselves as a central authority/middleman. If they weren't trying to position themselves as a middleman, they would just make the micropayments in Ether directly, or better yet, in a cryptocurrency that doesn't have a history of forking the blockchain to fix an bug in a major users' contract[3]. If they weren't trying to ride cryptocurrency hype, they'd just allow micropayments via a much-simpler-and-more-reliable REST API or similar since they're already the central authority anyway.

I don't think we can trust Brave with our privacy or attention. I don't think we can trust Brave with the decision of who gets paid for content. I don't think we need Brave as a middleman to pay content publishers. I don't like the state of how content is paid for on the internet, but I don't think Brave is the solution.

It's disappointing to me that Wikipedia has decided to associate their name with Brave's. A big part of why I respect Wikipedia is their long-standing policy of keeping independent from advertisers, and it seems naive of them to have not realized that Brave is an advertiser. I can understand why Wikipedia has made this decision, but I still think it is a compromise of Wikipedia's values, and I hope they'll reverse their decision in the future.

[1] https://brave.com/brave-ads-waitlist/

[2] https://brave.com/terms-of-use/

[3] https://www.coindesk.com/ethereum-executes-blockchain-hard-f...

Re: Wikipedia Is Now a Brave Verified Publisher

#198
post #3

I had never read the Brave ad model before. They want to display ads while respecting user privacy, which is nice from a user point of view, but do advertisers actually want that rather than being able to target 35-40 years old in Ohio that are using shaving products twice a week ?

Brave developer here. Great question! Brave Ads are entirely opt-in, and work via on-device machine-learning. The machine-learning bits study your browsing habits in a private, non-leaky manner. Once a day, your device downloads an aggregate catalog of many ad options to be studied locally. If/when an ad is found that fits your interests (as inferred by your browsing habits), the ad is displayed as an OS notification…

When do you build a digital assistant/agent that works on a similar model.

I would even volunteer some data for off machine I could choose which data goes. Aka speech data for training an agent.

Re: Wikipedia Is Now a Brave Verified Publisher

#199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wonder if websites will fight back, closing accounts or doing more to stop people who use adblockers or Brave. My personal belief is that websites are free to track users as much as they want, but users are free to respond however they want. If it becomes an arms race, so be it, but I think in the end the result will be adtech finally having to fix itself which is a very good thing.

Same here; I block ads. I am denying revenue to the website. What I am not doing, is giving a middleman that money instead. My conscience is okay with ad-blocking. It is not okay with helping someone steal.

I don't block ads but I just tend to avoid abusive websites.
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