Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

If you must run Windows 10

tinyapps.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

191–200 of 214 posts

Re: If you must run Windows 10

#191

Post by switch007 »

jedieaston wrote: post #170
switch007 wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

WSL2 is going to cement this episode of Embrace, extend and extinguish, in part as it requires Hyper-V and therefore prevents the use of VirtualBox, VMware Workstation/Player etc. The freedoms of Linux (such as not having a boot loader assume it's the only OS on the disk) will be forgotten as people take the easy path of running WSL2 on the OS their computer came with. Is this a sufficiently-modern criticsm for you?…

VirtualBox can use the Hyper-V/Windows Hypervisor API to create full speed VMs even when Hyper-V is active. https://www.virtualbox.org/manual/ch09.html#hyperv-support

I did not know that. However, a couple of caveats (from your link):

> This is an experimental feature

> When using this feature, you might experience significant Oracle VM VirtualBox performance degradation on some host systems.

Re: If you must run Windows 10

#192

Post by jodrellblank »

gardnr wrote: post #44
charlesdaniels wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who has used Linux (with a few brief stints into macOS and BSD) for quite some time (since about 2012) coming from Windows before that, I don't understand the people who constantly defend Windows in these types of posts... In principle, the feature set that Windows 10 ships could be useful. I don't find it appealing personally, but if it works well for you then that's great. The issue that I have had is th…

I subscribe to the conspiracy theory that there is a concerted effort from within microsoft to "engage in the community" where they encourage their developers and customers to respond to online posts that may be considered "anti-microsoft". Read everything with scepticism and check posting history.

"Company encourages employees to be helpful"

Linux users: "It's a conspiracy!"

If it's pushed by your employer, you aren't "conspiring" in any normal use of the word. And even if they are "working together" to respond to anti-microsoft posts, ... what are you suggesting they are conspiring to achieve?

Re: If you must run Windows 10

#193

Post by jevgeni »

beatgammit wrote: post #179
jevgeni wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The price is included in the price of the whole product. I mean, it’s not the price of materials that dominate Apple’s pricing. And you actually have to pay money to people developing the OS. So no, it’s not free.

You're paying for the brand, design, etc. Yes, Apple funds OS development though other sales, but it's not sold separately and new OS releases are free. As far as I understand the law, I can legally install macOS on a machine that did not originally come with it installed (hackintosh), with the caveat that I violate Apple's EULA by doing so. Microsoft bundles all sorts of software with their OS that can be installed…

That’s a bit of confusing things. My argument is that regardless of how these products are funded, they ARE funded and their target segment is different based on that source of funding.

MacOS is a premium product. Windows 10 Home edition is obviously not. You mention yourself in another comment that you estimate the cost of it to be around $40.

HN collectively throwing a fit because Windows 10 Home doesn’t fit their needs is silly, because they are not the target audience.

IF you intend to compare macOS with Windows, you need to compare same market segments, i.e. macOS and Windows 10 Pro.

Re: If you must run Windows 10

#194

Post by jevgeni »

blub wrote: post #160
jevgeni wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

macOS is way more expensive as well. Compare it with Windows 10 Pro for a fairer price point and ads are not a problem all of a sudden.

Ads are always a problem because they're manipulative communication. Forcing ads through the OS os is also very aggressive and rude, because there's no way to turn them off.

Well, you can get another OS, no? It’s not like it’s a monopoly.

Re: If you must run Windows 10

#195

Post by pergadad »

owenwil wrote: post #2

I see a lot of angry posts like this, but fail to understand how it's reflected in reality in 2019—I agree that Windows 10 was a little messy at launch, but it's come a long way from where many of these complaints seem to stem from. Yeah, Windows has a bad rap, but in the last 2-4 years has come leaps and bounds from where it was—implementing great, thoughtfully designed features on a regular basis, for free. With WS…

I bought a new HP Envy for 900€ but spent more than an hour getting rid of all the bloat. There's McAfee and HP stuff due to McAffee but it's my first new win10 laptop (previously just upgrade 8->10 and I am utterly appalled by the amount of crapware Microsoft included. Pre-installed MS software, and ads and unwanted products everywhere. Candy crush and similar junk included in a fresh clean start menu. Microsoft OneDrive in autostart. Cortana permissions pretty much make you agree to ads and constant listening (no thanks!). Lots of telemetry. Self-installing updates that reset settings. Nags to use Edge and Microsoft services everywhere. It took me far too long to even find (and even recognise) all the different always-hidden and ambiguously phrased buttons to switch all these features off - and the next update will turn them on again.

Why do I pay around €80 of the sales price for a license and still have to deal with all this intrusive upselling and ads?

Re: If you must run Windows 10

#196

Post by lawnchair_larry »

jodrellblank wrote: post #190
lawnchair_larry wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You cannot disable or control the phoning home. It’s pervasive. MS is obsessed with using telemetry to track everything you do, and they don’t believe users should have a choice.

they don’t believe users should have a choice. Microsoft adds more telemetry in PowerShell 3: https://devblogs.microsoft.com/powershell/new-telemetry-in-p... And there is an opt out. Guess they do believe users should have a choice.

Guess again!

Re: If you must run Windows 10

#197

Post by beatgammit »

twiceaday wrote: post #97
eberfreitas wrote: post #94

There is basically one reason why I use a Windows machine and that is games . I know linux has seen a lot of movement in that area (tks Valve) but I've tried it, and it works great, but performance is better in Windows for my machine. So I bought this machine where I can game (it is not anything fancy) and I would really like to work on it as well. I have a notebook with Ubuntu installed and if you would ask me I wou…

The sneaky bit about gaming is that it means your most powerful computer is reserved for Windows. I'd love to treat my Windows pc as a gaming console and keep a Mac as my personal computer but that would cost a lot more money so I just put up with Windows.

Why not dual boot?

Re: If you must run Windows 10

#198

Post by beatgammit »

saagarjha wrote: post #52
bhauer wrote: post #39

Microsoft needs to realize they are doing their name harm by not giving power users and evangelist-style technologists an obvious and easily-selected low- or zero-surveillance Windows version. If this article is mislead to select LTSC instead of Enterprise as that option (as is suggested in this thread), the confusion of Microsoft's messaging is largely to blame. Microsoft should have marketing material aimed at indi…

> Microsoft needs to realize they are doing their name harm by not giving power users and evangelist-style technologists an obvious and easily-selected low- or zero-surveillance Windows version. Why can't they do this for everyone?

Because regular users don't seem to care, and Microsoft obviously gets some value out of it. If it's easy for power users to do it, it should be pretty easy for regular users to do so as well, it's just that power users would think to check.

Re: If you must run Windows 10

#199

Post by blub »

wayneftw wrote: post #172
blub wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. Updates are done through settings. 2. Advertising is communication about a product or service. A product is not advertising in itself, logic doesn't work like that. It's also worth differentiating what one gets: free, quality apps with a decent privacy policy vs. pay to win games in Windows. You're trying a too hard to excuse customer-hostile behavior and it's embarrassing.

> You're trying a too hard to excuse customer-hostile behavior and it's embarrassing. That was rude. I’m telling it like I see it. Did I offend your favorite OS or corporation or something like that? Why get personal with me?? 1. OS updates had not been done through settings for a long, long time. However updates to Apples preinstalled applications are done through the App Store... Anyway, if it was OK for Apple to d…

You're playing some kind of game where me and others have to repeatedly explain things to you in detail, only for you to come up with yet another technicality to trip us up and waste our time.

A significant amount of people view games like Candy Crush as crapware and those so-called icons as ads. There are articles from multiple reputable publications discussing how to turn off start menu ads. Some Microsoft-developed Windows 10 apps also have ads and yes there's guidelines available on how to get rid of them.

It seems that many MS customers have spoken, and they think MS's approach to ads sucks. And we will continue to complain about that, even if those ads don't match your strange definition of what an as is or should be.

Re: If you must run Windows 10

#200

Post by blub »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #9

LTSC is not intended as a desktop operating system. What people should be looking for is Enterprise: Which has all of the telemetry 0 options and such, but still works with modern Windows applications. It's highly likely especially after Windows 7 goes EOL, you'll start seeing a lot more consumer applications that depend on Windows 10 functionality that's not going to work in LTSC.

The enterprise edition is not much better. The Dutch ministry of justice and security hired a company to investigate this and the conclusion was "New DPIA on Microsoft Office and Windows software: still privacy risks remaining".

https://www.rijksoverheid.nl/documenten/rapporten/2019/06/11...

Post reply on HN