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How and why I transitioned to Linux, and how you can too

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Re: How and why I transitioned to Linux, and how you can too

#191

Post by [deleted] »

drb91 wrote: post #38
joe_the_user wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

has all the software I need and lacks BS like the Windows interface. Darn, pardon me. I should have said the Windows 10 interface. Yeah, Mate is copying Windows 7/Vista task bar stuff, with perhaps less of that system's unneeded flash.

So it copies the user interface of windows, with all its problems, but it doesn’t carry over the reliable variable DPI support, a notifications framework, a unified reliable software management interface, and consensus on how to provide basic utilities like secret management, file associations, and accessibility controls for the visually impaired. That is, the features of windows ACTUALLY worth copying. Linux is stil…

[deleted]

Re: How and why I transitioned to Linux, and how you can too

#192

Post by SomeHacker44 »

gst wrote: post #47

I've used Linux since the early 1.x kernel versions, but for my next laptop I'm thinking about switching to a MacBook. Not because of the software (I prefer Linux to macOS), but because of the hardware. Apple seems to be the only manufacturer that so far escaped the race to the bottom and which still produces somewhat premium hardware. I want: a hidpi screen with lots of nits and a good contrast, a trackpoint or a hu…

Warning: I have had three keyboard replacements in two years with my 2016 and 2017 MBPs, and I have been lucky compared to some of my colleagues. I am thinking of switching OFF Mac because the hardware reliability is now so low and each keyboard fix is a week long send it out repair that sometimes wipes all your data. Insane.

Re: How and why I transitioned to Linux, and how you can too

#193

Post by [deleted] »

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #39
_emacsomancer_ wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you have Windows-only software, you can always just be a "pirate", flip Microsoft off and block all updates, telemetry and whatnot It's an awful lot of work to maintain this, and of dubious value with the end result being running a second-rate OS.

Windows is a first rate OS saddled with some stupid bullshit that's been piled on top of it. And be fair, maintaining a Linux configuration just the way you like it is a lot of work too. If it weren't, there wouldn't be hundreds of slightly-different distros.

[deleted]

Re: How and why I transitioned to Linux, and how you can too

#194

Post by jenscow »

leppr wrote: post #164
andrepd wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Installing a program (not from the Ubuntu Software Center) and getting a launcher icon took way too much time and Googling. I don't understand this. You can open the "App Store" and search and download programs. If, for some inexplicable reason, you don't want to use the Software Center, you can open a terminal and type "apt install [name]". Surely this is easier than installing a program on Windows. What exactly is…

Installing a program on Windows that's not on the App store: With installer: - Download installer - execute installer by double clicking on it Without installer: - Download .exe - (Optional) Drag'n'drop .exe to some random folder - Right click .exe and select "Create desktop shortcut" All of that is way more intuitive for a regular user than entering even one string of text in a terminal. People aren't trained to ent…

There's a significant piece of information omitted from those instructions: From where do you download the installer? How do you know the source you are downloading it from is the official one?

And there's the dreadful download pages with ads that look like download buttons, which are more obvious than the real one.

Also, don't forget to inspect every option of the installer to ensure you're not allowing the installation of bundled adware, toolbars, and search page hijackers. And these are sometimes bundled by the distributor.

Every mainstream Linux distro has an "app store"-like GUI application, where you click install and it installs. Click uninstall, and it uninstalls. You should try it - you'll be impressed.

Re: How and why I transitioned to Linux, and how you can too

#195

Post by jenscow »

Reelin wrote: post #153
andrepd wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Installing a program (not from the Ubuntu Software Center) and getting a launcher icon took way too much time and Googling. I don't understand this. You can open the "App Store" and search and download programs. If, for some inexplicable reason, you don't want to use the Software Center, you can open a terminal and type "apt install [name]". Surely this is easier than installing a program on Windows. What exactly is…

The issue is that installing something that's not in the official repositories and getting a functioning .desktop file set up for it can (in some cases) be a complete PITA if you don't already possess a reasonably detailed understanding of how the desktop launcher system works under the hood.

Do you have an example?

If you're at the point where you're downloading software that isn't in the repo, and their packages don't create a shortcut, then you're at the level where you can figure out how to do it yourself.

Re: How and why I transitioned to Linux, and how you can too

#196

Post by andrepd »

leppr wrote: post #164
andrepd wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Installing a program (not from the Ubuntu Software Center) and getting a launcher icon took way too much time and Googling. I don't understand this. You can open the "App Store" and search and download programs. If, for some inexplicable reason, you don't want to use the Software Center, you can open a terminal and type "apt install [name]". Surely this is easier than installing a program on Windows. What exactly is…

Installing a program on Windows that's not on the App store: With installer: - Download installer - execute installer by double clicking on it Without installer: - Download .exe - (Optional) Drag'n'drop .exe to some random folder - Right click .exe and select "Create desktop shortcut" All of that is way more intuitive for a regular user than entering even one string of text in a terminal. People aren't trained to ent…

Correction:

- Open browser - Type program name - Navigate maze of adware, crapware, and ad-ridden websites, download the stuff you want from "softpedia" or a similar dodgy website; somehow miraculously download the actual software instead of a virus. - Open .exe - Navigate installer

While in Ubuntu/Linux Mint:

- Open the software center - Type program name - Click Install

See?

Re: How and why I transitioned to Linux, and how you can too

#197

Post by andrepd »

Reelin wrote: post #153
andrepd wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Installing a program (not from the Ubuntu Software Center) and getting a launcher icon took way too much time and Googling. I don't understand this. You can open the "App Store" and search and download programs. If, for some inexplicable reason, you don't want to use the Software Center, you can open a terminal and type "apt install [name]". Surely this is easier than installing a program on Windows. What exactly is…

The issue is that installing something that's not in the official repositories and getting a functioning .desktop file set up for it can (in some cases) be a complete PITA if you don't already possess a reasonably detailed understanding of how the desktop launcher system works under the hood.

I can only say I never had such a problem. I can count with my fingers the number of times I had to do that (Zotero, Nullpomino), and by "that" I mean "right-click > add desktop shortcut".

Re: How and why I transitioned to Linux, and how you can too

#198

Post by bootlooped »

andrepd wrote: post #196
leppr wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Installing a program on Windows that's not on the App store: With installer: - Download installer - execute installer by double clicking on it Without installer: - Download .exe - (Optional) Drag'n'drop .exe to some random folder - Right click .exe and select "Create desktop shortcut" All of that is way more intuitive for a regular user than entering even one string of text in a terminal. People aren't trained to ent…

Correction: - Open browser - Type program name - Navigate maze of adware, crapware, and ad-ridden websites, download the stuff you want from "softpedia" or a similar dodgy website; somehow miraculously download the actual software instead of a virus. - Open .exe - Navigate installer While in Ubuntu/Linux Mint: - Open the software center - Type program name - Click Install See?

This is a pretty biased representation. You're assuming that there either is no official website for the windows app or it cannot easily be found, and that the linux app is in the distro's software center.

You've presented the worst case scenario for windows and the best case scenario for linux.

A recent example of one of my installation experience for a certain application:

- Download tar.gz file from official website

- Move to appropriate installation folder

- Extract files from archive

- Look at readme contained within for further instructions

- Give execute permissions to the install script

- Execute install script

- Copy location of app launch script and create shortcut

- Download icon from google image search and add that to the shortcut so it looks right

A lot of steps required the googling how to do it and/or using the command line. Would normal users go through this? Would they even be able to in some cases? It's been claimed anybody who needs special software is already advanced enough to know how to do this. Ok, maybe, but I also don't want to have to, it's a pain.

Admittedly what I outlined is not the normal case of installing an app. Usually it is very easy with the software center. You can't hand wave away the shitty experience for anything that's not there though. Even with the technical knowledge to get it done, who wants to? Installing the same program for Windows would have required downloading the .exe from the official site and running it.

Re: How and why I transitioned to Linux, and how you can too

#199

Post by dysoco »

gbuk2013 wrote: post #157
Animats wrote: post #83

I've used Linux on the desktop for over a decade. Currently, Ubuntu 16.04 LTS on x64. It still sucks for the average user. The GUI is lipstick on a pig. As soon as anything goes wrong, it's back to the command line. You look up the problem, and there will be a dozen articles about it, all contradicting each other. Look up what it takes to create a desktop icon for something. (Hint: the top result in Google won't work…

I’ve been running Linux Debian Sid) as my primary OS for well over a decade and it’s great not to be an average user. It has come so far over the years (back from when kernel / Xorg / drivers whatever) has to be compiled to get things to work. Now it mostly just works, although some effort is always required. Over the years I have reduced my GUI usage to a minimum (it is still very useful for some types of operations…

Have you used Arch Linux by chance? How would you compare Sid's stability to Arch?

Re: How and why I transitioned to Linux, and how you can too

#200

Post by bootlooped »

zzo38computer wrote: post #107

I have used Linux for some time (I do not remember how many years), and it works very well. I uninstalled the desktop environment (I don't use it (but I do use X, with a window manager, which is not the same as the desktop environment); I use the command shell to start programs and for almost all other purposes too). It is much better than Windows! Someone mentions restoring a Ubuntu system after a hard drive replace…

I was a person who said I was disheartened to see how much the command line was required. I like the option to use the command line, I just don't want it to be the only option, especially for what I consider basic stuff.
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