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Six Months at Riot Games

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Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#191

Post by rsynnott »

lmm wrote: post #74
EliRivers wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem to be suggesting that such a culture is not an impediment to success, based on the existence of some success. I could blindfold myself and throw darts at a board. The fact that I hit the board sometimes doesn't mean that the blindfold isn't an impediment. Many more movies fail before even reaching the screen. Just because we see some success doesn't mean that the culture isn't an impediment to success. Perha…

If you won competitive darts championships while blindfolded, that would suggest the blindfold wasn't an impediment. Given how long the movie industry has been around and how many studios have gone bankrupt through competition, I would think that any cultures that significantly impeded productivity would have been stamped out by now.

> Given how long the movie industry has been around and how many studios have gone bankrupt through competition, I would think that any cultures that significantly impeded productivity would have been stamped out by now.

A movie studio is generally either very successful, or soon dead; there's not that much middle ground. So relatively small optimisations (such as not creating a hostile work environment that drives away employees) may not have much of an effect on survival.

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#192

Post by rsynnott »

xsace wrote: post #58
EliRivers wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yet it could be impeding success, like throwing darts at a board while blindfolded. I'll still hit the board sometimes. So is the blindfold no impediment?

Well I still think it shouldn't come as a surprise. We've got many example of successful industries with such culture, why would video game work any different.

The average company in the video games industry isn't like what's described; it does seem to be especially bad.

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#193

Post by base698 »

trowawee wrote: post #135
zimablue wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the Ho thing was clearly an attempt at humor, and an attempt to "bring her in" to the group. It's like an old job where I was called a coal miner (being the only guy from north England). It's a nice thing, you're taking stick but that's how male groups normally bond. Instead of taking the humor as it's intended she takes offense, and what's really happening is that instead of submitting to their culture and j…

There's an enormous gap between calling someone a sex worker and calling them a coal miner. There's an even-more-enormous gap between calling most of your team "bros" and calling the one woman on your team a sex worker. That is not in-group bonding, that's targeted, gender-based harassment.

Seems like a shit test. I've been in companies where the women were better at it than the men and perfectly able to stand their ground.

> Those who consider themselves “a bullshit free zone,” eg: masculine men will “ball bust” (read: shit test your ass a new one) quite relentlessly to determine “just how much of a man you are.” If you are an effeminate or timid man, you will feel bullied rather than challenged and this tells the group everything they need to know about you.

https://illimitablemen.com/2014/12/14/the-shit-test-encyclop...

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#194

Post by nathanaldensr »

irb wrote: post #141
pjc50 wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's enough of a pro-sexism faction to flag it off the front page, this usually happens to discussions of sexism in tech.

The typical reaction of HN to articles about sexism in tech is basically proof in and of itself of sexism in tech.

I reject this assertion. I am certainly not sexist, but I flag stories like these because they belong on Reddit discussion forums. Hacker News should be for tech-related discussion, in my opinion.

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#196

Post by stormcode »

tinderliker wrote: post #176
stormcode wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just because something is the predominant culture does not make it right or okay. It's not like going to France and getting offended that everyone is speaking French. Strip clubs, tit jokes, objectifying others, homophobic slander, and transphobia as part of a company 'culture' is toxic.

Don't impose your morals on a community you don't belong to. That's called colonialism btw.

I've played league for 3 years, and have been a game developer for 12.

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#197

Post by camel_Snake »

nathanaldensr wrote: post #194
irb wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The typical reaction of HN to articles about sexism in tech is basically proof in and of itself of sexism in tech.

I reject this assertion. I am certainly not sexist, but I flag stories like these because they belong on Reddit discussion forums. Hacker News should be for tech-related discussion, in my opinion.

Out of curiosity did you also flag the recent posts about Tesla going private or the NYT financials?

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#198

Post by sctb »

unstableph wrote: post #93
almostCEO wrote: post #48

A woman writes a post saying she’s offended by typical male jokes. The majority of employees are male, but they have to instead adapt to the vocal minority that can’t take a dick joke. I understand there are idiots but stories like this encourages me to never hire women, because they’re obviously over-sensitive and will at some point write a “I have been offended and this company is sexist” post and nobody will quest…

>stories like this encourages me to never hire women When you hire, you have to consider if the person is a good cultural fit. Sex of the applicant falls into that category; if productivity is fine in your male-dominated workplace, don't put that in jeopardy by hiring a female.

We've banned this account for trolling.

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#199

Post by berbec »

rsynnott wrote: post #186
glenneroo wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's some crazy conspiracy-theory level shit happening... it was #1 a couple hours ago with 80ish votes... now ~215 and you're right, it's dropped off to the 6th or 7th page! Is it getting flagged a lot? Why would that happen in a few hours?

The gamergate crowd, I'd assume. Normal for this sort of story, unfortunately.

If we quickly get these articles off the front page, we don't have to think about it anymore. Then we can go back to living in the perfect world where sexism is invented by the left to bring down people in the poor, innocent bro culture.

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#200

Post by sctb »

almostCEO wrote: post #71
zimablue wrote: post #56

Looking at this skeptically, given that as she says she put a target on her own back there's not much concrete here about problems she personally faced. Companies have a culture, it might not be your culture, and it's mental to expect to be able to walk in and attack it in the first six months then everything be sweetness and joy. Joining a gaming company and complaining about female outfits is roughly equivalent to…

I am sorry to see your comment in gray. I was heavily downvoted as well, but I share your views fully. The counter-example of a female-dominated environment is food for thought. At work, I just avoid women altogether and go for lunch with guys so I can say almost anything without offending anyone.

Regardless of your views, please start posting civilly and substantively (that you avoid women is not something that we benefit intellectually from learning) or we'll ban the account. This site is not here as an ideological arena.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

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