I was listening to a Software Engineering Daily podcast with Lex Fridman about self-driving deep learning.
Very interesting topic on ethics of self-driving cars. What he was saying, is that we need to accept the fact that people are going to die following incidents with autonomous vehicles involved. In order for systems to learn how to drive, people will have die. It's more of societal change that is needed. 30,000 people die on the roads in US every year, in order to decrease that number we need self-driving cars even with a price that society as of now can't accept
NTSB: Autopilot steered Tesla car toward traffic barrier before deadly crash
191–200 of 546 posts
Re: NTSB: Autopilot steered Tesla car toward traffic barrier before deadly crash
#192Earlier quoted context omitted.
It doesn't matter if he was following another car or not. If there is an obstacle, AP2 should brake and in that case it should brake hard or use evasive turning maneuvers to avoid head-on collision.
That’s the thing, it clearly didn’t detect the obstacle. Given that there were no (known) obstacles, it behaved correctly. Fix the obstacle detection.
The problem is it's entirely possible the obstacle detection is un-fixable without swapping out the sensor suite the Tesla ships with. Tesla is quite clearly expecting the problem to be solvable with that sensor suite alone (this is more-or-less the line I was given by a Tesla seller when I was shopping for a car), so it's not going to be in the T-sheet for them to recall every Tesla on the road to fit a LIDAR to them, assuming that's at all feasible.
Re: NTSB: Autopilot steered Tesla car toward traffic barrier before deadly crash
#193NTSB: • At 8 seconds prior to the crash, the Tesla was following a lead vehicle and was traveling about 65 mph. • At 7 seconds prior to the crash, the Tesla began a left steering movement while following a lead vehicle. • At 4 seconds prior to the crash, the Tesla was no longer following a lead vehicle. • At 3 seconds prior to the crash and up to the time of impact with the crash attenuator, the Tesla’s speed increas…
What's your source for the claim that Tesla's system "doesn't detect stationary objects"? From the reference frame of a moving Tesla, both globally stationary and globally moving objects will appear to be in motion.
Aside from resolution, another reason suggested is to avoid slamming on the breaks in the middle of a highway for false-positives.
https://www.wired.com/story/tesla-autopilot-why-crash-radar/
Re: NTSB: Autopilot steered Tesla car toward traffic barrier before deadly crash
#194Earlier quoted context omitted.
Out of curiosity, are you not in the U.S.? These types of lane dividers are incredibly common throughout the country. Note that I'm not defending the safety of them; I'm just surprised to see someone call them out as a hazard as they're such a common sight.
Dutch citizen here, I have never seen something like this. To compare, here's a similar situation in The Netherlands: https://www.google.nl/maps/@52.0928662,5.1734685,3a,75y,281.... Points of interest: - big solid white arrow, line-fade is nearly impossible - white-green sign indicating that the road is splitting - big shoulder in the continuation of the division - loads of grass instead of immediately using a metal…
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Re: NTSB: Autopilot steered Tesla car toward traffic barrier before deadly crash
#195Earlier quoted context omitted.
I get that in 5-10 years we MAY have SDVs that are superior than human drivers. But I think a lot of people have a mental model of SDVs _right now_ being superior to human drivers. I can't remember the crash stats, but I think the only way to know for sure is to calculate the number of miles a single human generally drives on average before they are involved in a collision or crash, etc... Now I don't have the number…
We don't have exact numbers for Tesla but there are 2 confirmed casualties in what is conservatively over a billion Autopilot miles. The average casualty rate for human drivers is something around 1.25 death per 100 million miles. Those numbers are not directly comparable given that Autopilot is not something that is used during 100% of all driving miles and Tesla drivers are not average car drivers. However, there i…
Keep in mind that a billion miles is a very small number in this context. People in the U.S. alone drive well over 3 trillion miles every year [1]. We simply don't have enough data yet to say that autonomous vehicles are safer.
[1] https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/02/21/516512439...
Re: NTSB: Autopilot steered Tesla car toward traffic barrier before deadly crash
#196Anyone here actually think Elon uses autopilot?
Don't forget rule number 1: never get high on your own supply
Re: NTSB: Autopilot steered Tesla car toward traffic barrier before deadly crash
#197After this incident and Tesla's response to it, I hope Tesla is sued and or fined into bankruptcy. Tesla is normalizing releasing not fully tested software to do safety-critical things, and literally killing people as a result. A message needs to be sent that this is unacceptable. In addition, their first response is a PR driven response that sought to blame to driver, and violated NTSB procedures. Safety is probably…
And a helpful lesson for all the "excessive government regulation" people.
Whether regulation is insufficient or excessive should be determined on a case-by-case basis. Anybody making blanket statements about all regulation as a whole is an ideologue who probably should not be taken seriously.
Re: NTSB: Autopilot steered Tesla car toward traffic barrier before deadly crash
#198Beleve somone in this article ?
http://everydayhappy7.com/2017/06/15/genius-one-husband-13-w...
Re: NTSB: Autopilot steered Tesla car toward traffic barrier before deadly crash
#199Earlier quoted context omitted.
I get that in 5-10 years we MAY have SDVs that are superior than human drivers. But I think a lot of people have a mental model of SDVs _right now_ being superior to human drivers. I can't remember the crash stats, but I think the only way to know for sure is to calculate the number of miles a single human generally drives on average before they are involved in a collision or crash, etc... Now I don't have the number…
We don't have exact numbers for Tesla but there are 2 confirmed casualties in what is conservatively over a billion Autopilot miles. The average casualty rate for human drivers is something around 1.25 death per 100 million miles. Those numbers are not directly comparable given that Autopilot is not something that is used during 100% of all driving miles and Tesla drivers are not average car drivers. However, there i…
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Re: NTSB: Autopilot steered Tesla car toward traffic barrier before deadly crash
#200I was listening to a Software Engineering Daily podcast with Lex Fridman about self-driving deep learning. Very interesting topic on ethics of self-driving cars. What he was saying, is that we need to accept the fact that people are going to die following incidents with autonomous vehicles involved. In order for systems to learn how to drive, people will have die. It's more of societal change that is needed. 30,000 p…
> we need to accept the fact that people are going to die following incidents with autonomous vehicles involved.
Car accidents will kill people at least as long as there are any human-piloted vehicles on the road and probably long after (pedestrians, etc.)
What doesn't need to happen is companies in the self-driving space recklessly exaggerating their cars' ability to self-drive.