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More than half of all private wealth has been inherited in most of Europe

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Re: More than half of all private wealth has been inherited in most of Europe

#191

Post by jogjayr »

walshemj wrote: post #161
jogjayr wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OTOH passive investment will only track the market and return an average of 7-10%. Compared to that small-time landlording (which I define as 1-10 units), a popular side-income stream for many working professionals, returns 10-20% in return for higher risk and volatility (you could get bad tenants or have units go vacant). Also since passive investment requires "no skill and little luck" it's one of the few entry rou…

Its not fraking "income" for gods sake if you don't know the difference between income and capital gain you probably should learn it before commenting on this issue.

"Unearned income includes investment-type income such as taxable interest, ordinary dividends, and capital gain distributions."[1]

"Unearned income includes things like annuity payments, pension income, distributions from retirement accounts, capital gains, interest income, dividends, passive income generated from rental real estate, alimony, stock dividends, and bond interest." [2]

Sorry...is that what you meant? Or were you referring to the definition of earned income?

1. https://apps.irs.gov/app/IPAR/resources/help/unearn.html 2. https://www.thebalance.com/earned-income-is-taxed-differentl...

Re: More than half of all private wealth has been inherited in most of Europe

#192

Post by kiliantics »

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #155
aaronblohowiak wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet “Fifty-seven percent of Americans don't have enough cash to cover a $500 unexpected expense”. We suck at saving as a country.

15% of those are in poverty. This doesn't let you save up money. One in two americans are low income. [1]. I'd not call these number exact, but close enough. Much of the group you describe only suck at saving because their income sucks. $50-$100 extra a month doesn't make it easy to save up $500 for an emergency. Literally months. Months with nothing happening. Not a flat tire, not a doctor's appointment. Nothing bre…

There's a great reddit comment that explains this in a relatable way. It's very expensive to be poor:

https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueReddit/comments/1v4t18/it_is_ex...

Re: More than half of all private wealth has been inherited in most of Europe

#193

Post by ataturk »

justicezyx wrote: post #76
gbacon wrote: post #45

The flawed thinking that wealth is a pie of fixed size wherein gain by one is necessarily another’s loss is known as mercantilism and was long ago discredited as bunk economics.

Or it was what they want you to believe.

I think the matter is well documented. Wealth is not a zero-sum game. However--you have countries that deliberately hold people down. Everyone wants safety nets and such. That all has a huge effect on individual upward mobility.

Re: More than half of all private wealth has been inherited in most of Europe

#194

Post by closeparen »

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #155
aaronblohowiak wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet “Fifty-seven percent of Americans don't have enough cash to cover a $500 unexpected expense”. We suck at saving as a country.

15% of those are in poverty. This doesn't let you save up money. One in two americans are low income. [1]. I'd not call these number exact, but close enough. Much of the group you describe only suck at saving because their income sucks. $50-$100 extra a month doesn't make it easy to save up $500 for an emergency. Literally months. Months with nothing happening. Not a flat tire, not a doctor's appointment. Nothing bre…

As the linked article points out, we have defined terms like “poverty” and “low income” relatively, so telling us the percentage of people they cover doesn’t convey any information.

The 57% figure is much more illustrative, in large part because it conveys an absolute capability which people can lose or acquire.

Re: More than half of all private wealth has been inherited in most of Europe

#195

Post by dragonwriter »

closeparen wrote: post #94
gbacon wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How then is it possible that some four in five American millionaires inherited no more than ten thousand dollars, according to The Millionaire Next Door by Thomas Stanley?

A median-income household owning a median-priced house and making the standard 15% 401k contribution will clear "millionaire" by retirement age, easily.

> A median-income household owning a median-priced house

A median-income household is unlikely to own a median-price house for a reason very similar to the reason they are unlikely to own a median priced jet, because home ownership isn't uniformly distributed across income levels, as low income households are more likely than high income households to be renters, and high income households more likely to be homeowners (and to own multiple homes.)

If a median-income household owns a home, it is likely to be a singificantly-below-median-value home.

Re: More than half of all private wealth has been inherited in most of Europe

#196

Post by stale2002 »

mmierz wrote: post #179
stale2002 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes it was. It was earned by the person who made the money. Would you rather all the wealthy people in the world just blow all their money on yachts or something? Because that is the alternative. Why bother saving money if it is all just going to be confiscated when you die. Instead you should just blow it all on ridiculous things that help nobody but yourself in the immediate time frame.

It doesn’t help “nobody”. It helps people that build yachts. And then the people who sell things to the people that build yachts. And on, and on. Working people spend their money.

So would you rather yacht builders get more money, or would you rather people's children get a good education because their parents paid for it?

Re: More than half of all private wealth has been inherited in most of Europe

#197

Post by walshemj »

jogjayr wrote: post #191
walshemj wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not fraking "income" for gods sake if you don't know the difference between income and capital gain you probably should learn it before commenting on this issue.

"Unearned income includes investment-type income such as taxable interest, ordinary dividends, and capital gain distributions."[1] "Unearned income includes things like annuity payments, pension income, distributions from retirement accounts, capital gains, interest income, dividends, passive income generated from rental real estate, alimony, stock dividends, and bond interest." [2] Sorry...is that what you meant? Or…

Trouble is "unearned income" is one of those dog whistle worlds like "rent seekers" - which tends to lead to rants about "the gold standard" and onwards to well we all know where that ends.

Re: More than half of all private wealth has been inherited in most of Europe

#198

Post by RyanZAG »

capisce wrote: post #184
RyanZAG wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> improve the life quality of those born with less potential While a noble goal, I don't believe this is a goal shared by the majority of the population. I think if you ran a poll between "improve the life quality of those born with less potential" and "improve the progress of humanity", the results would favor the later. Is it better to bring fresh cold water to all, or hot and cold water to some? If it cost $100 to…

> While a noble goal, I don't believe this is a goal shared by the majority of the population. Then why do most countries have welfare for the poor? > I think if you ran a poll between "improve the life quality of those born with less potential" and "improve the progress of humanity", the results would favor the later. What's the point of improving the progress of humanity if not to actually make life better for the…

> Then why do most countries have welfare for the poor?

Because of democracy.

The rest of your points are good and I agree with them. Just pointing out that "improve the life quality of those born with less potential" is probably not a goal most people strive for. I do hope I am wrong, but I don't believe I am.

Re: More than half of all private wealth has been inherited in most of Europe

#199

Post by smsm42 »

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #153
smsm42 wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can access 401k under "financial hardship", after paying taxes and 10% penalty. Of course, it's rarely worth it for $500 - it'd be better to find a credit card with 0% APR or other credit option, if you have access to those. I imagine most people with 401k's do have access to credit. Am I wrong? You can also loan against 401k (though there are limits, but if you have it for a while loaning $500 would not be a pro…

"I imagine most people with 401k's do have access to credit. Am I wrong?" Yes. Low-paying jobs at Wal-mart and Lowes and some gas stations offer a 401k. The contributions are tiny because the checks are tiny but the company usually contributes as well. These folks aren't as likely to have access to credit. I'll put this as well: If you are looking to take $500 from your 401k outside of those groups, I'm gonna guess t…

Hmm I didn't know Walmart offered company-matched 401k. In that case, if they have contributed there at least $100 (which I think should be possible with company match if you work fulltime) for a year, there should be enough money to take a loan of $500 AFAIK.

> If you are looking to take $500 from your 401k outside of those groups, I'm gonna guess things have gone horribly wrong

Yes, probably, but the question was is it possible, when the things go horribly wrong. I still think if you have 401k that should be possible.

Re: More than half of all private wealth has been inherited in most of Europe

#200

Post by isostatic »

coliveira wrote: post #108
jopsen wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is probably also why it would be hard to implement :) Also I'm not sure discouraging invests is a good side effect.. But it's an interesting thought nonetheless.

This is why taxing wealth is done at the time of inheritance.

Easy to avoid if you have enough to be worried about.
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