Live data from Hacker News

Why Cutting Carbs Is So Tough

nytimes.com

191–200 of 275 posts

Re: Why Cutting Carbs Is So Tough

#191

I think "carbs are bad" is sort of overgeneralizing the problem. The problem isn't carbs, it's processed carbs that are low in fiber - i.e. not vegetables. That said, I've experienced all this same stuff with processed carbs and sugar. I'll beat it for a few months and then end up binging/getting right back hooked. The best recipe I've found for managing weight (personally, since YMMV is super applicable when it come…

> weightlifting 3-4 times a week

I don't really notice much fat being burned on a keto diet without regular exercise.

Re: Why Cutting Carbs Is So Tough

#192
post #114

What is so annoying about articles like this is that they start out saying 'calorie intake has nothing to do with obesity! lol all you idiots! look at how enlightened I am!' and then go on to say that carbs mess with insulin levels so that it becomes hard to not eat more calories. Duh, that's what all those others say too, but just not highlighting that aspect as much. In the end, it's still calories. I get it, these…

> calorie intake has nothing to do with obesity who is saying that? > that's what all those others say too where? the author is talking about energy balance disorder vs insulin hypothesis. first stops at "expend more than you intake and everything will be ok", second goes further and explores difference between sources of calories and why it's wrong to say that caloric number is all you need to care about. > show me…

"who is saying that?"

"The conventional thinking, held by the large proportion of the many researchers and clinicians I’ve interviewed over the years, is that obesity is caused by caloric excess." "The minority position in this field — one that Dr. Ludwig holds, as do I after years of reporting — is that obesity is actually a hormonal regulatory disorder, and the hormone that dominates this process is insulin."

5 or so paragraphs in. Waffling and innuendo about how it's really not about calories, while when you look deeper, it is - but they never acknowledge it as such because if they would, WTF would be so special about it?

"second goes further and explores difference between sources of calories and why it's wrong to say that caloric number is all you need to care about."

Caloric number is all you need to care about. It's just easier to control when your blood sugar levels don't swing all over the place.

Caloric intake is like the first oscillation on a 1D Perlin noise function; cutting back specific foods (not 'sources of calories', but specific compounds that have a certain effect on the body) are a second oscillation, transposed on the first one. So you can cut back all the carbs you want, if you don't get your daily energy intake below your energy expenditure, you'll never lose weight. There are other ways of losing weight too, that would work for everybody, but they're mentally hard(er). You can lose weight by eating a McD hamburger and small portion of fries each day, as long as you don't eat anything else (actually, after those two, you still have a 1000 cal budget left, which you could expend on another two portions of fries, or pure sugar if you'd like, and you'd still loose weight).

"you really should read up on ketogenic diet before criticizing it."

I'm not critizing the low carbs diet itself; it's well-known that cutting back on carbs is a relatively easy way to loose weight. When I used to fight and had to cut weight, it was standard advise to the point that it was obvious to everybody who'd spend any time in the gym, even those who had been doing it since the '80s at least. What I'm critizing is these shysters who peddle this sort of 'advise' as something or somehow magical or more than a trick to make it easier to get you calorie intake down. Because that's all it is. A good trick, sure, but still just a way to get your calorie intake down.

Re: Why Cutting Carbs Is So Tough

#193
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only diet that works is caloric restriction. You can follow any fad diet you want, but if you don't expend more calories than you ingest you're not going to lose weight. Replace all the carbs in your equilibrium diet with the same amount of fat per mass and you're going to start gaining weight. It's as simple as that.

You're missing the point of the low-carb theory. It's not claiming that you should eat above a deficit. It's arguing that a pure energy-deficit view of dieting is wildly impractical. Longitudinal evidence of dieters over 2-20+ year windows will routinely point out that people cannot stick to calorie-deficit diets, cannot estimate calories, etc. Modern nutritional science is also showing that the way food is digested…

Yes, this is a great post. I've known many in the keto community who have a dismissive attitude towards the calories in calories out mentality. Too often they simply say "CICO is nonsense!" without explaining what they really mean.

Sometimes science literate ppl think these ketoers just don't understand the 2nd law of thermodynamics, but that's not the point. Its true that the 2nd law determines weight loss, but changing your hormonal response is how you really achieve a healthy lifestyle.

Re: Why Cutting Carbs Is So Tough

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used it twice to lose weight, and it worked perfectly. The hungry and tired problem goes away quickly and your body just switches to burning more fat. But you're right about filling up - that's very simply the most important part. Don't eat lots of small high-calorie stuff. Eat a real meal that fills you up. In carbs that would be fiber-heavy, long chain carb stuff, protein does that pretty much by itself.

>> The hungry and tired problem goes away quickly and your body just switches to burning more fat. Didn't happen when I tried it for a couple of years. I guess it didn't help that this was the '90s when hype for the diet was making people irrational, and the people I was dependent on forced it on me. Stress and resentment make anything harder. Maybe I'll give it another shot in the future. Right now, eating filling m…

When you tried it before, was it low-carb and high fat? Or high protein? The high fat versions were new to me a few years ago.

Re: Why Cutting Carbs Is So Tough

#195
post #4

Because they are delicious. Life is too short, not to enjoy one of life's simple pleasures. Obviously moderation is key, but it's silly not to take advantage of being human.

Ribeye steaks, pork, chicken, and other fatty meats are also delicious! One does not need to be an ascetic in order to give up carbs :)

Re: Why Cutting Carbs Is So Tough

#196
It's really not hard to cut carbs, it's just a habit and exercise in minimal self control like almost anything else in life. Eat more meat and more vegetables, it's really that simple.

If you can't manage that because you love rice or pasta or bread, at least replace processed and refined carbs with whole grains and you'll be much better off.

And don't eat sweets or sugars, which are garbage. Have fruit or high quality dark chocolate if you want something sweet or indulgent.

Re: Why Cutting Carbs Is So Tough

#197
post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> your body needs a fair amount of carbs every day, and people are cutting bad carbs without replacing them with good carbs, and thus experiencing an inescapable craving for carbs. I'm sorry but this is simply not true. Since switching to a ketogenic several months ago I have maintained a very low (< 15g / day) net carb intake and not only have I not experienced any adverse effects from this, I feel much better (bett…

That is rather rude. Your single data point (if we are to be generous and call it data) doesn't change the fact that an overwhelming majority, heck probably 99.9% of humans that ever lived included various sources of carbs in their diets (save famine and other such events), and our bodies have evolved to support such diets. We're here because our ancestors ate carbs. The long term effects of ketogenic diets OTOH are…

> That is rather rude

Not my intention at all, and honestly I don't see how my comment conveys this.

> Your single data point

Sure, plus the countless others who lead a healthy, low-carb lifestyle.

> 99.9% of humans that ever lived included various sources of carbs in their diets (save famine and other such events), and our bodies have evolved to support such diets

My point wasn't that carbs preclude you from leading a healthy lifestyle, hut rather that they aren't necessarily for leading a healthy lifestyle, as OP's remark suggested.

> We're here because our ancestors ate carbs

Not "because", but "in spite of the fact".

> You should make it clear that you're pushing a position based on your opinion

I'm not "pushing" anything, merely citing a personal experience (my experience, not my opinion).

Re: Why Cutting Carbs Is So Tough

#198
post #46

I've posted these numbers before, but I'll post them again because they are so low as to be totally unintuitive: Normal human blood sugar [1]: 70-100 milligrams per deciliter of blood. Blood volume of average human [2]: 5.5 liters Thus, total blood sugar in non-diabetic human: 3.85 to 5.5 grams Density of glucose: 1.54 grams per cubic centimeter Thus, total volume of sugar in average human: 2.5 to 3.6 milliliters Vol…

Blood sugar isn't the right comparison; glycogen is.

Re: Why Cutting Carbs Is So Tough

#199

There's a lot of people here who are really into this, but this is really the opinion of a minority of nutrionists, without a large body of scientific evidence supporting them. Low-carb diets are being sold to the public on a ridiculous premise: the quality of foods can be identified based on their major macronutrients, and "carbs" consists of a coherent group of foods. This is ridiculous because it lumps refined sug…

Just want to mention that there are always people who don't read the literature or properly follow a "diet plan" for lack of a better word to call it. If you are doing the Ketogenic diet, right at the end of Gary Taubes' book entitled "Why we get fat and what to do about it" which is about the diet (and is the same the guy who wrote the linked article) it says this about your daily diet in regards to vegetables: FOOD…

My point is how this is communicated to the public. It's nice that you have spend dozens or hundreds of hours reading ketogenic diet books, and have a clear idea about the limitations, tradeoffs, and risks of this.

Ordinary members of the public get the message "only eat chicken thighs, and don't eat lettuce". That's a long way from a diet that's healthy for ordinary people.

Re: Why Cutting Carbs Is So Tough

#200
'"These studies represent the first rigorous scientific tests of the carb-insulin model in humans," Hall added. "The public needs to understand that this [insulin-carbohydrate] model now has pretty strong evidence against it."' https://www.vox.com/2016/7/6/12105660/do-low-carb-diets-work
Post reply on HN