Earlier quoted context omitted.
I've been a developer for 30 years, helped start a half dozen companies. Since college I've never written a single tree traversing algorithm, and would need to Google red-black tree to know what it is. There is a whole world of development that is OS specific, UI specific, shipping commercial applications. Shipping quickly is always a higher priority than performance, because adequate performance is usually trivial t…
I'm not entirely sure adequate performance is good enough when you work at the scale of Google...
Why I Don’t Talk to Google Recruiters
191–200 of 674 posts
Re: Why I Don’t Talk to Google Recruiters
#192Being an agency recruiter in 2017 is becoming impossible in that fewer and fewer people are even willing to talk to you, which is one reason I've diversified into resumes and coaching. I have almost 20 years in the industry, led a large successful users group for 15 years, have published tons of content for tech pros (often critical of recruiters), and have a pretty solid reputation in the industry, I write targeted…
I used to respond to just about every recruiter email/call. Problem is, as you noted, that so much of what I receive these days is spam that I've stopped bothering to reply to most of them. Now, occasionally I'll receive a well crafted email that was obviously specifically targeted to me and I'm so impressed that I have to reply :)
Re: Why I Don’t Talk to Google Recruiters
#193There is no point in giving me binary-tree-traversing questions; I don't know those answers and will never be interested in learning them. Let's presume this is out of preference and not ability. It's a pretty basic concept. If your preference stops you from learning something as basic as this as a programmer, then it doesn't seem likely that you will be motivated to keep up with even more abstruse concepts. Nearly e…
It's also not realistic, given the wheat-to-chaff ratio out there, for a manager to interview all the candidates directly without an elaborate screening process, although the 'get interviewed by some generic programmer who has a cheat sheet for the Hard Questions you are working through on the fly' seems like an anti-pattern. I have talked to all of our groups hires as a near-final step.
There's a valid point in there somewhere, though. The recruiters that Google uses locally, for example, seem clueless enough to not care that their approach is quite offensive to someone who is not junior and/or desperate for a job. For several years, every few months, I got a come-on from our local Google office that seemed to be implying that working for Google was So Neat that I would probably want to drop 2-3 levels down the SE -> Senior SE -> Staff SE -> Senior Staff SE -> Principal Engineer chain, AND I would only have to carry a pager 1 week out of 4 as a Site Reliability Engineer. Well, hey, that sounds like a real step up from running a team doing something I really like at my current employer and getting to dream up SIMD tricks and algorithms all day! I'll get right on that. My very own pager!
Re: Why I Don’t Talk to Google Recruiters
#194Amazon won't hire you just for one role. The company allows free movement between teams by SDEs. If you're an SDE, you're an SDE, and you're welcome to change teams so long as the new manager will take you. If you don't know algorithms, maybe that's okay for the team you're joining. But hiring you means screwing over the team you're going to be on in 3 years. That's why they interview that way.
Nit: I believe you can't move more freely than once every 30 days or so. ;)
Re: Why I Don’t Talk to Google Recruiters
#195Yeah it kind of sucks, but from Google's perspective it's absolutely necessary. So many people talk the talk, run a blog, have a neat looking resume/website/GitHub and just cannot perform. Unless you're an undisputed rockstar in a specific area and they're hiring exactly for your expertise you can't expect anything else. It's a huge waste of time to custom tailor to each candidate when 90% won't receive an offer. > T…
> Take an afternoon and skim Cracking the Coding Interview before applying. First, I know this isn't a black or white issue but the problem I have with this is that I'm wondering if they are hiring people with the skills they want or are they hiring people with the skill to succeed in their test. In theory, they should be the same. In practice... I don't know.
I'm not really selecting for people who are really, really good with binary tries -- I'm selecting for people who display those qualities, the question is pretty much incidental.
Re: Why I Don’t Talk to Google Recruiters
#196With very much ease I can ask the interviewer/dev to solve a seemingly simple algorithm, where I'm almost 100% sure he will fail, even if I'd gave him 6 hours to solve it.
I've seen so much horrible code in my life, there is no fizz buzz test that can prevent you from that. I am wary of companies doing these tests as it tells me they have no clue what my work is about.
If a company wants to hire me they can look at some of my production code and the live results of it. If that is not good enough for them I'm not interested.
Re: Why I Don’t Talk to Google Recruiters
#197Earlier quoted context omitted.
> They're not looking to fill any particular role. They're just looking for smart people I've found this to be decidedly not true, from many recruiter contacts. They have a role in mind they're trying to fill and if you point out that it's far more junior than what you're looking for, the conversation's over. Think about how must companies hire. The hiring manager fights internally and finally gets a req for a very s…
> I'd love to see a company literally just looking to snap up smart people and then have them come in and kind of define their own role, one where they can add the most value. Nobody does this! I don't know about letting people "define their own role", but a lot of the biggest companies are constantly hiring without a specific role in mind. If you've got thousands of employees then your best strategy is just hire the…
Re: Why I Don’t Talk to Google Recruiters
#198Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why should skilled developers with extensive track-records in their field be forced to use their free time to cram for college-style exams? Other professions dealing with exact-sciences / engineering don't seem to have this problem..
While I agree with the sentiment, I wouldn't call it "college-style exams", to be honest. Colleges would be quite different if exams were conducted one-on-one, and instructor would have been willing to talk with you through the problem and cared more about your thought train and approach rather than the exact solution. In fact, I am pretty sure that if you just knew the correct solution and the answer to the coding i…
No, jesus. Some people need to switch to a presentation mindset and out of a problem-solving mindset. This is completely normal in life.
I'm starting to think most interviewers are terrible only for not having a decent amount of social interaction with strangers. Let's just admit it's 90% hazing ritual at this point so we can get on with putting up guides to get through it.
Re: Why I Don’t Talk to Google Recruiters
#199> There is no point in giving me binary-tree-traversing questions; I don't know those answers and will never be interested in learning them. They are just looking for smart people. If you ever looked it up it's 5 lines of code. That's the whole point they're not forcing you to learn something: A) so esoteric you will never encounter in your programming career B) so complicated that you'd have to spend days practicing…
multiply that 5 lines of code by all the possible algorithms they couldve asked about instead of this one. Thats what you need to know walking into the interview, seems kinda stupid
Re: Why I Don’t Talk to Google Recruiters
#200Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why should skilled developers with extensive track-records in their field be forced to use their free time to cram for college-style exams? Other professions dealing with exact-sciences / engineering don't seem to have this problem..
While I agree with the sentiment, I wouldn't call it "college-style exams", to be honest. Colleges would be quite different if exams were conducted one-on-one, and instructor would have been willing to talk with you through the problem and cared more about your thought train and approach rather than the exact solution. In fact, I am pretty sure that if you just knew the correct solution and the answer to the coding i…