Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

An Email Thread Between a Developer and Gigster

andychase.me

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

191–200 of 271 posts

Re: An Email Thread Between a Developer and Gigster

#191

Post by hfsktr »

maxlybbert wrote: post #152
matthewcford wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "work not related to company's business and not done on company time/equipment doesn't count" We would have similar terms but sometimes people work at home not on company equipment or within normal working hours, so it's normal for this term to be a bit broader, but in general most companies would agree that you can keep the rights to work not related to company business (if you ask and they are reasonable).

I don't remember if it was mentioned in my contract, or if I just looked up state law. I remember when I had a job in Nevada, state law effectively said that work done on my own time, off premises, using my own equipment was mine. I realized that it would be possible to do work on my own time, with their equipment, etc. and I figured if I wanted to avoid a headache it would be my responsibility to make sure I clearly…

So I've wondered this. If I use a work computer to update some person code on github or blog or whatever online, outside of business hours.

Does that fall into their equipment or not? I always assumed yes but I can find arguments for either answer.

Re: An Email Thread Between a Developer and Gigster

#192

Post by ghurtado »

logicallee wrote: post #183
ghurtado wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sean Spicer, is that you?

There's nothing anti-developer in what I wrote. (Or the original reply.) If I received such an email in response to my own question I would be reassured. I'm not towing/toeing the company line here. There's simply nothing wrong here. -- EDIT: in reply to your followup, no, I googled and it's some Trump spokesperson? (communications director). Basically I took it (in this comment I added this edit to) that you were sa…

You don't know who Sean Spicer is, do you?

Re: An Email Thread Between a Developer and Gigster

#193

Post by ABCLAW »

logfromblammo wrote: post #65
theli0nheart wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't agree in the slightest. If anything, developers who ask questions are the ones you want most . One of the worst traits in a developer is the tendency to say yes to everything.

Besides that, you're endangering the contractness of your contract if the other party cannot negotiate any of its terms, and indicates any confusion over just what it is he or she may be agreeing to--especially if they express their confusion in a document that can later be produced in court . If I were to sign that "contract", I would certainly send the other party a written "signing statement" that interprets all p…

With respect, this advice is tremendously dangerous. The existence of a helpful theory of the case does not provide you with the protections you seem to believe it does.

Re: An Email Thread Between a Developer and Gigster

#194

Post by danielweber »

levlandau wrote: post #145

Cofounder here. Really appreciate the discussion and all of the feedback. The spirit of the contract's never been intended to be unreasonably restrictive -- though I totally understand the concern. We wanted to include certain terms since as part of our model, we do own the code written specifically for Gigster projects. We certainly don't want to own code folks write outside of Gigster projects. We've received very…

> We've received very similar feedback recently

So why was the line "We have yet to have a disagreement (much less a legal battle) over the terms here" issued to the developer?

Re: An Email Thread Between a Developer and Gigster

#195

Post by 20years »

"We have yet to have a disagreement (much less a legal battle) over the terms here. We have completed thousands of successful milestones and payments without issues with the terms and we unfortunately cannot adjust them on a case by case basis."

Note to self: Don't hire Gigster developers. If a dev does not pay attention to this kind of stuff or thinks it's okay, I don't feel all that comfortable having them work on my projects.

Re: An Email Thread Between a Developer and Gigster

#196

Post by roflchoppa »

ghurtado wrote: post #171
jjnoakes wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please don't advocate for making willfully misleading statements to one's employer which might have legal repercussions (IANAL, etc).

1. There's nothing willfully misleading about asking a hypothetical question 2. You do not have an "absolute transparency" duty to your employer about all aspects of your personal life. Please don't behave as if you do.

yeah dude my mom programmed all that stuff in her spare time. <:0

Re: An Email Thread Between a Developer and Gigster

#197

Post by nbadg »

ekidd wrote: post #42

I've worked as a consultant for years. I occasionally employ a lawyer to review contracts with my clients. As a general rule of thumb, I'll only work for a client under one of three circumstances: 1. The client's standard contract is reasonable. This is rare. 2. The client's standard contract is unreasonable, but they're willing to cross-out or rewrite the objectionable bits before signing. This is very common. 3. It…

> The other reason why I wouldn't touch a site like Gigster is that those sites almost always turn into a race to the bottom for low-value jobs for the most difficult clients.

I've never actually taken a contract from one of these sites, but having looked at them before, this has been my observation every time I've considered it. Spend 20 minutes browsing posted contracts, getting increasingly frustrated, and then just write off the entire site.

The thing is, these sites aren't well-suited for creating contract relationships. To make money, they want to keep you at the site. Plus all of the commissions, etc. It's just like Homejoy, etc -- the value add is in the initial intro, but they're trying to make money off of you perpetually. It's not sustainable and it's never that successful in the first place.

Word to the wise: if you want to build a site that does something like this -- any potentially long-term arrangement where money is being exchanged for services via contract -- start by building a cross between Craigslist and Yelp, and then, once you're established as a good way for clients to find contractors, offer them some kind of long-term value add (automatic invoicing, timekeeping, whatever). Monetize the latter, but keep the former free.

Re: An Email Thread Between a Developer and Gigster

#198

Post by BinaryIdiot »

adekok wrote: post #148
levlandau wrote: post #145

Cofounder here. Really appreciate the discussion and all of the feedback. The spirit of the contract's never been intended to be unreasonably restrictive -- though I totally understand the concern. We wanted to include certain terms since as part of our model, we do own the code written specifically for Gigster projects. We certainly don't want to own code folks write outside of Gigster projects. We've received very…

> we do own the code written specifically for Gigster projects. That's good. > We certainly don't want to own code folks write outside of Gigster projects. That's good. But the contract apparently says something else. This reminds me of a contract gig I had a while ago. I asked them similar questions about their contract, and they said "that's not what we intend to do". OK... so could they update the contract to stat…

I mean, what would you like them to do? They're aware of it (and this thread obviously shined a brighter light on it) and are going to go over it with their lawyers. Isn't that reasonable? Contract changes don't exactly come quickly especially with expensive lawyers involved.

I'm just not sure what you would like them to do about it right now.

Re: An Email Thread Between a Developer and Gigster

#200

Post by hluska »

ghurtado wrote: post #173
danpalmer wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If this comment had been the last email response in the chain, I think that would have been great. The fact that it wasn't, that an important issue was dismissed when raised in private, speaks far more to me than this public response.

Damage control. They went from "lol, you're the only one with a problem, get lost!" to "hmmm, this is generating bad publicity.. now we definitely sympathize with your concerns!" real quick. As far as I'm concerned, I now know all I will ever need to know about Gigster. Your reputation is something that takes a lifetime to build and only 5 minutes to ruin permanently.

> Your reputation is something that takes a lifetime to build and only 5 minutes to ruin permanently.

This is the most important takeaway from this entire sad thread. Wonderful comment!

Post reply on HN