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A Farewell to FRP

elm-lang.org

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Re: A Farewell to FRP

#191

Post by Gaelan »

notduncansmith wrote: post #143
malandrew wrote: post #140

Since people in this thread are likely to be elm enthusiasts and know what's going on in the ecosystem, what is the largest high quality elm app you know about and what is the largest high quality elm app that is open-source that you know about? I've been doing backend work for a while and I'd like to see what is possible these days with elm.

I think NoRedInk, who employs Evan (author of Elm); they also host Elm meetups in SF and are a really friendly bunch. On an unrelated note, I haven't found much prior work here but I think Elm on the backend (via Node.js) could be fantastic.

There's always Haskell. :)

On a slightly more serious note, I wonder if Haskell and Elm are similar enough that model-style code could be written in a shared subset and run on both sides.

Re: A Farewell to FRP

#192

Post by bootload »

malandrew wrote: post #140

Since people in this thread are likely to be elm enthusiasts and know what's going on in the ecosystem, what is the largest high quality elm app you know about and what is the largest high quality elm app that is open-source that you know about? I've been doing backend work for a while and I'd like to see what is possible these days with elm.

"what is the largest high quality elm app you know about and what is the largest high quality elm app that is open-source that you know about?"

http://builtwithelm.co is a good place to start. My favourite big example is Dreamwriter (https://dreamwriter.co) by Richard Feldman. Warning not updated since e0.15.1 ~ https://github.com/rtfeldman/dreamwriter

Re: A Farewell to FRP

#193

Post by junke »

vanderZwan wrote: post #161
junke wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do you have a link to your thesis? There is only a French version: https://tel.archives-ouvertes.fr/tel-00680308/ The context is about using a constraint programming approach (in Prolog) to model Lustre/Scade programs and automatically generate traces of input/outputs that satisfy a given test objective. With the help of my advisers I extended the GATeL tool to introduce what is known as "clocks" in Lustre and inte…

I get the impression that synchronous programming is somehow only really known inside the French PL community, is that correct?

Synchronous programming is mostly a French thing but as far as I know there is also Quartz in Germany (https://es.cs.uni-kl.de/publications/datarsg/Schn09.pdf), Ptolemy in Berkeley (http://ptolemy.eecs.berkeley.edu/publications/papers/01/sr/s...) and some work at Virginia Tech (https://theses.lib.vt.edu/theses/available/etd-08112011-1613...).

Re: A Farewell to FRP

#194

Post by Ciantic »

bootload wrote: post #192
malandrew wrote: post #140

Since people in this thread are likely to be elm enthusiasts and know what's going on in the ecosystem, what is the largest high quality elm app you know about and what is the largest high quality elm app that is open-source that you know about? I've been doing backend work for a while and I'd like to see what is possible these days with elm.

"what is the largest high quality elm app you know about and what is the largest high quality elm app that is open-source that you know about?" http://builtwithelm.co is a good place to start. My favourite big example is Dreamwriter ( https://dreamwriter.co ) by Richard Feldman. Warning not updated since e0.15.1 ~ https://github.com/rtfeldman/dreamwriter

Do you know any examples heavy with animations? E.g. similar that can be achieved with CSSTransitionGroup in React. While I can't use Elm in production app, I could dabble on it side projects, but I'm a little bit put off by the examples it has, they seem to not contain complicated appear/leave animations or animation managers. I think it's not yet solved?

Re: A Farewell to FRP

#195

Post by pdamoc »

Gaelan wrote: post #191
notduncansmith wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think NoRedInk, who employs Evan (author of Elm); they also host Elm meetups in SF and are a really friendly bunch. On an unrelated note, I haven't found much prior work here but I think Elm on the backend (via Node.js) could be fantastic.

There's always Haskell. :) On a slightly more serious note, I wonder if Haskell and Elm are similar enough that model-style code could be written in a shared subset and run on both sides.

They are close enough that people have produced tools like elm-servant that generates Elm code from Servant code.

https://github.com/mattjbray/servant-elm

Re: A Farewell to FRP

#196

Post by danek »

powersurge360 wrote: post #184
marcosdumay wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, I find that when my C++ compiles When I first learned Java, still in my undergrad, my first impression (and nearly everybody's) was that when it compiles it works. It was still more work than Perl, Lisp, Prolog, and everything, but didn't require the annoying C debugging cycle. But, anyway, all that is kids play near Haskell.

Hello! I don't know if English is your first language or not, but that last sentence was significantly confusing that I wanted to correct it for you and others who may read it. The two idioms are 'child's play' & 'next to'. The words are correct synonyms but the usage is unusual enough that I read as having a totally different meaning my first time.

I was also confused by it. However I read the last sentence as the author making a meta-point by using purposefully incorrect grammar, a sort of reversal of the first sentence about c++ code compiling but leading to segfault--like an artistic statement. If it was an accident, then all the better!

Re: A Farewell to FRP

#197

Post by pdamoc »

notduncansmith wrote: post #143
malandrew wrote: post #140

Since people in this thread are likely to be elm enthusiasts and know what's going on in the ecosystem, what is the largest high quality elm app you know about and what is the largest high quality elm app that is open-source that you know about? I've been doing backend work for a while and I'd like to see what is possible these days with elm.

I think NoRedInk, who employs Evan (author of Elm); they also host Elm meetups in SF and are a really friendly bunch. On an unrelated note, I haven't found much prior work here but I think Elm on the backend (via Node.js) could be fantastic.

There are experiments with using Elm on the server via Node.

Since you mentioned NoRedInk, they had a sample project that bundled several available technologies: https://github.com/NoRedInk/take-home

It is worth noting that with the advent of 0.17, Elm on server is getting closer to reality. The issue now is for Evan to properly understand what the best approach is. My hope is that we will end up with something like Servant in Elm.

In a lot of things Elm is not aiming at WOM but WOFO. In other words, not for libraries that gets most word of mouth but libraries that get word of f-ing obvious. That requires a more deliberate and slower process but the payout is huge.

Re: A Farewell to FRP

#198

Post by jrcii »

sridca wrote: post #83
ccapndave wrote: post #43

I moved from React/Redux/Typescript to Elm a few months ago, and I'm now on my second serious project with it, making mobile application with Cordova. I've found it an absolute pleasure to use, and I especially like that you can be pragmatic about it; if there is something that is annoying to do in Elm then you can simply drop into Javascript/Typescript using ports. Coming from languages like Actionscript/Javascript/…

> if it compiles, then it just seems to work That's exactly been my experience with Elm. For example, on a web project I had been working on I decided to add the 'search' feature; the very first change[1] actually worked! This is generally not possible with JavaScript. [1] https://github.com/srid/chronicle/commit/4a6c18147bf1596b234...

Whenever I write a bunch of code that works right away I'm highly suspicious that I'm missing something.

Re: A Farewell to FRP

#199

Post by weq »

e0m wrote: post #32

There's also a lot of similarity with Rx.JS and observable based (aka "Reactor") patterns: Rx.Observable.fromTime().subscribe(tick) Rx.Observable.fromSocket(mySocket).subscribe(handleEvent) https://github.com/Reactive-Extensions/RxJS Regardless of the exact library or pattern, the broader concept of treating data sources as asynchronous event streams you can subscribe and react to definitely simplifies data flow and…

Exactly. Rx was created by MS research for Azure -- mostly to abstract away the threading model in the cloud - why reinvent the wheel when Observable / Rx is built for every platform you use and is fantastic.

When ELM came along with its signals, im like, meh, why not Rx? Im not even going to bother to learn it, your at v0.1 and ur gonna see why u need it soon enough. Subcritiption? Dont reinvent the wheel like Redux? Why not Rx? A few months later, everyone is going "how we we handle async actions properly?" Well thats an Observable my dear friend!

Just like when Flux "came out". They just rebranded Event Sourcing in the client UI.

Im getting pretty fed up with all this mumbo jumbo. I write C# mostly, i like FRP, ES, unidirectional flows. Im going to bring a slim universal c# solution with a typescript/JS bridge to the OSS community. The main philosphy is, one client/server architecture, to build scable responsive apps. With builtin backpressure handling.

If ppl had just embraced Rx like 6years ago when it was first V1'd, imagine how much further along the road we would be now? Like seriously, get over urself OSS fanboys, just cause its MS, doesnt mean its bad.

Re: A Farewell to FRP

#200

Post by Paradigma11 »

weq wrote: post #199
e0m wrote: post #32

There's also a lot of similarity with Rx.JS and observable based (aka "Reactor") patterns: Rx.Observable.fromTime().subscribe(tick) Rx.Observable.fromSocket(mySocket).subscribe(handleEvent) https://github.com/Reactive-Extensions/RxJS Regardless of the exact library or pattern, the broader concept of treating data sources as asynchronous event streams you can subscribe and react to definitely simplifies data flow and…

Exactly. Rx was created by MS research for Azure -- mostly to abstract away the threading model in the cloud - why reinvent the wheel when Observable / Rx is built for every platform you use and is fantastic. When ELM came along with its signals, im like, meh, why not Rx? Im not even going to bother to learn it, your at v0.1 and ur gonna see why u need it soon enough. Subcritiption? Dont reinvent the wheel like Redux…

/agree.
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